wpfloor

My daughter has a 94 Civic that has always started at the touch of the ignition key. Suddenly yesterday, it decided it won't start any more. The fuel pump is fine, and the car cranks like a champ (new battery). But it will not turn over at all -- as if it is not getting any spark. Took off the distributor cap and tapped the ignition and the flywheel inside (if that's the right term) spins. Went to AutoZone where it was recommended I replace the distributor cap, which I did. Nothing. Stuck my screwdriver into two of the spark plug holders to see if any arc, and nothing. Any ideas?

Thanks in advance for noodling on this one ...

Bill F

tinman

Ignition coil first, then the igniter module.

They DO sometimes just die.

Jrfish007

iTrader: (3)

So when you tap the rotor (or as you call it flywheel) inside the cap it spin? Or does it it spin when you the engine turns over?

Jrfish007

iTrader: (3)

True, but on that car the coil is inside the disrubutor (sp?) and rarely goes bad because it is well protected. I haven't heard of them going bad, but it could happen. If so, you can take it to autozone and they'll test it for free. If the coil was/is going bad you should have very carbon fouled spark plugs.

wpfloor

With the distributor cap off the rotor moves freely by hand, and if I try to turn over the starter, the rotor spins. The spark plugs are not fouled.

Jrfish007

iTrader: (3)

The rotor should not turn freely. So you have 1 of 2 problems. 1, there is a screw that is on the rotor that tightens to a shaft in the distributor, maybe that screw is lose allowing the rotor to turn. 2, the shaft the rotor is on has broken, allowing the rotor to turn freely.

Let hope for number 1, because then you can buy a new rotor from autozone for about $10-15. If it is number 2, you will need to either replace the entire distrubtor, or find out why the rotor shaft is not conntected and fix that part. A new distrubtor for that car is about $300, if you have time, you maybe able to find one off Ebay or a local junkyard for around $100 (I priced them for that exact car about a year ago).

You may just want to remove the rotor and see if you can turn the shaft it connects to, you should not be able to do this. If the shaft turn, you will eventually need a timing light, so unless you have one, you'll probably be looking at going to a shop. Hopefully the screw that holds the rotor in place is just broke.

wpfloor

I TOLD YOU GUYS WRONG -- The rotor will NOT turn by hand, but it DOES turn when I hit the ignition, so the screw to the rotor is neither loose nor broken.

I am tempted to just go buy a new distributor and see if that fixes the problem. But I don't want to spend that kind of money unless you advisors tell me you are about 99.9% sure that this will fix the problem. I am guessing what is on the car now is original equipment, so I supposed replacing the whole thing isn't a bad idea - IF it will fix the starting problem.

So I need you to tell me if you feel comfortable that would do the trick -- or is there something else we haven't considered yet?

Finally, if you advise me that replacing the distributor is the way to go, I need to know if this is something I can do myself relativelliy easily and safely. Back in the "good old days" when you could actually get to things on cars, I used to work on them a lot, but haven't for years, and don't even have any testing equipment any more. So if this is a matter of basically taking off the distributor and putting on a new one, I'll do it. But if there are 900 steps, measurements, etc., I have to go through, maybe it's best I get it to a shop ... ??? I really hesitate on the shop thing not only because of the added cost, but where the car is sitting now is a good 20-25 miles from the nearest place, and I am not anxious to have the car towed.

So please advise -- including if you think replacing the whole thing is overkill, and that I should just replace this part or that ... I have always been a little averse to replacing parts within modules, if you will, as it seems like the other parts then start going bad -- would rather just replace the whole thing -- IF you guys think that makes sense.

I look forward to your counsel, and thanks again for all the help.

Bill F

streetglower

iTrader: (13)

really, you need to find out what is causing the problem. now one here wants you to spend $200-$300 on a new distributor if that isnt your problem. And dont listen to autozone. If your car doesnt start, do you really think the first thing is going to be a new distributor cap. No. You need fuel, spark and compression for a car to run. You also need a battery.

Anyway, physically check everything. How do you know your fuel pump is fine? Have you checked for fuel pressure at the fuel rail? Spark, physically chekc for spark output. Pull a wire with a plug in it and ground it to the block and crank the car. You should see it spark. If not, you know you have a ignition problem.

Now you could possibly have a bad coil or bad module, but dont assume it and replace it. You know how pissed you are going to be if you buy a new distributor, replace it and the car still doesnt start. Noone here is 99.9% sure on what your problem is. We are only giving you guesses on what it may be.

Start ruling out certain things. if you end up having no spark, then more then likely the issue is related to the distributor since everything is in the distributor.

wpfloor

I guess I'm assuming it's in the distributor because:

1) The fuel pump seems fine. We tested it by taking off the bolt to the fuel filter and cranking the engine -- fuel spewed out clear to the driveway. (I have no idea how to check for pressure at the fuel rail);
2) The battery is (literally) brand new;
3) The crank is very strong -- the engine just won't turn over (at all)
4) A check for spark with a screwdriver in two of the plug holders produced no spark/arc at all upon crank

Thoughts?

Btw, I would never hold anyone accountable for a "99.9%" confidence feeling that turned out to be wrong ... I am basically just asking for some assurance from those who know more than I that based on the evidence presented, the distributor (or something therein) seems logically and likely the culprit.

Bill F

streetglower

iTrader: (13)

a cars fuel system needs pressure and volume to start. It can be spitting out fuel as fast as hell, but have no pressure. CHeck for pressure at the rail with a fuel pressure gauge.

As for checking for spark, I have never heard of doing it that way and dont know how accurate that is, but pull a wire from the cylinder with the spark plug, then with the wire attatched to the plug and the plug grounded to the block, crank the engine and watch for the spark plug to fire.

Like everyone else, you probably do have a ignition problem, but you need to rule out other possibilities. and the best way to do it is by checking for fuel and spark. If you check for pressure at the rail and have around 30-40 PSI, then I would be more suspicious of the ignition system.

Also, you dont need to repalce the whole distributor. All parts inside are replaceable seperatley. SO you could have just a bad coil assembly, or just a bad ignitor.

wpfloor

Thanks for the advice. Should I find out there is not adequate pressure at the rail, what does that indicate is wrong?

streetglower

iTrader: (13)

no pressure at the rail indicates a faulty pump. SInce you are getting volume, you can ruel out a electrical problem in the fuel circuit.

but if you dont have a pressure tester, do the ignition test first because if you dont have spark, then you dont need to go buy a fuel pressure tester.

use this to help you for the ignition if you want to test to see which component failed.

http://autozone.com/servlet/UiBroker...3d80140d73.jsp

wpfloor

Thanks ... appreciate the help

tinman

UGH!!

Check all your fuses. There may be one for the ignition. I used to pull mine as a cheap engine kill. If not, measure for 12 volts at the distributor with the ignition on. Also if you have a tach, does it move AT ALL when you crank? If it does, change the coil. If it does NOT, change the ignitor module.

wpfloor

Thanks for all the advice! I'll let you know how it turns out. Meanwhile, if anyone has anything else, I'm all ears ...
Bill F

Jrfish007

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, check to see if you are getting spark. Given the info above (the rotor is not turning freely) I would not buy a distibutor. I would work backwords through the ignition system. If you are not getting spark, check to make sure the plugs are okay, then check the resistance in the wires, the pull the coil out and take it to autozone, they'll check it for free. Check the ground wires too, make sure the enigne is grounded.

wpfloor

Thanks again to all ...

belue

Hey, I just read your thread and I had the exact problem happen to me today. I cleaned my car yesterday, drove fine, then this morning I try to crank it up and it will not start. It has a strong turn, but will not turn over and crank. I also am not getting any fire to my plugs. Sounds like it could very much be the same problem. If there is any thing I can do let me know and thanks for your thread, I find it very useful, and will be looking to see if you had any luck. I gotta get my car going, but same as you, I am not going to throw away money if I don't have to. Thanks again.

Keiodra

I Bought A New Fuel Pump Relay And It's Still Not Cranking Also A New Fuel Pump

BrotatoChip

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