AngelAssassin

i recently replaced my suspension (shocks, control arms, ball joints, springs) on my car and am having some issues trying to find alignment specs for a lowered civic. i also went from 195/60-14 wheels to 205/45-16 wheels. needless to say i didnt realize my car was going to be sitting 6" off the ground when i was under the impression that i had 25mm room for adjustments. i was told it was an automatic 1.5 inch drop but it feels like i lost a total of 3-4" O.O ok...so i guess my question is what can i do to either raise my car at least an inch and/or keep my tires from getting chewed up by my wheel wheels and still manage to drive straight at speeds higher than 60mph without feeling like im driving drunk....sober?

Zeferint

iTrader: (2)

any pictures? im having a bit of a hard time picturing this.. so you're saying the wheel is basically hitting the top of the wheel well because you dropped it so much? what kind of springs/shocks did you get?

civicexracer

I'm a little unclear..

Did you replace your suspension with aftermarket parts? If so, what did you get?

There are no specific alignment specs for a lowered car. Generally you would want to set your toe within factory spec. Camber generally isn't an issue with these generation civics unless you are lowered more than ~2.5inches.

The tires on your new wheels are the correct size, there should not have been any ride height change by changing your wheels.

AngelAssassin

I will post pictures as soon as I figure out how to here.

I put on Koni sport struts. H&R springs. Skunk 2 upper control arms. The wheels look tucked under the wheel well when straight. If you turn the wheel they appear to barely clear the fender...just as long as I don't make a sharp turn.

(I'll post pictures as soon as I can)

AngelAssassin

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?fbid=10150090100773536&id=768593535&aid= 281353#!/photo.php?fbid=10150131489148536&set=a.10150090100 773536.281353.768593535&type=1&theater

this is the back view.... dont know if this link works but i will get another picture up to show the front wheel

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

upload pic to your profile or use photobucket photo hosting or similar... Instructions are here.

I am in no mood to sign-in and then login to facebook just to see your pics.

AngelAssassin

Gotcha....
I forgot about photobucket.

Thanks. I'll get those up this weekend.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

OK!
Not to bash, but not everyone would like to login facebook in the middle

AngelAssassin

Let's see if this works

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Seems your rear end is higher than your front. What kind of lowering system are you running?

AngelAssassin

I put Koni sports struts and H&R springs on. They are at the highest adjustments. Then I went from 14" to 16" wheels which are a little wider. I softened the dampers about a half turn to make the ride softer so I didn't feel every bump. I just want to be able to raise the front end about an inch. But my main concern is the steering. I've got the camber set -1.5 and the toe -0.1. The caster is completely off. I have one wheel back farther than the other.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Hmm... your absolutely sure its at the maximum height? That front end looks like its been dropped 3-4" as you said. I wonder if your struts are having issues already

AngelAssassin

Oh the rears have 3 pre settings. Fronts have two.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

Well.. I don't think your going to get fender rub because being that low the suspension must be really stiff... so maybe lower the rears to match the fronts for now.. Get your struts checked out to make sure they are still okay because the drop is a lot lower than you expected. How much of a drop are the struts rated for? If they are too low they can blow quickly.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

RU sure you did not put the front/rear springs inversed?

civicexracer

Good or bad shocks have no affect on ride height. Shocks only control movement. Springs are what determine ride height.

There is an exception for the Koni shocks though! You can adjust the ride height a bit with the Koni shocks by changing the location of the spring perch up or down. This type of ride height adjustment is not found with other shocks...

You said you have all of the shocks at their highest ride height setting? This is most likely your problem. The front shocks should have the circlip on the top(highest) setting. The rear however should have the circlip in the MIDDLE setting.

Here are some pictures to help you visualize and for those who don't know what I am talking about or aren't familiar with Koni shocks.




Your rear is probably on the top setting right? Try moving the circlip down one setting and see how the car sits. Just be very careful not to break the circlip when you change the setting.

I'm not 100% sure but I can only imagine when you drop the rear down, the front will raise up a bit. This will give you a bit more positive camber up front giving you less issues. However, do not worry about camber. Just get your toe set and you will be fine.

Those springs are not very stiff and you can rub your fenders with soft or stiff springs. Wheels size and offset play a more important role in determining whether you will rub on your fenders or not.

The springs might be on the right way. The ride height settings on the shocks just might be off.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

hun, did not know the koni's for civics had the same adjustment - they have on miatas, but this is the first time i see the civic version, to be honest...

And i need to say that if the shocks are too stiff, they actually let the spring down but not up... My AGX actually lower the left rear corner - jacked down by the damper when i set it stiff... When i set 3 (of four), the height increases in the rear.

civicexracer

I know the Koni's for '92-'00 Civics have the ride height adjustment, I THINK the 4th gen civics also have it. '01+ uses McPherson suspension so there is no ride height adjustment on the shocks for them. Koni uses inserts for the factory struts.

AngelAssassin

Thanks everyone. I'll be working on these suggestions this week and will update the results.

AngelAssassin

Ok. Put my car in the air. Before im able to make adjustments I noticed my tires inner tread is gone. I'm told I have too much positive toe...basically Im dragging my rear tires. I've only had these on 4 weeks. I'm told I need to replace the upper control arms in the back with adjustable ones for the toe. But I also need the part for adjustable camber. Anyone have suggestions for parts/websites? Be much appreciated. Thanks!

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

?
Does the upper arm provide toe changes too? different than a 7th gen, it does not have the hub/knuckle portion, so i guess it could change the angle? Usually for 7th gen the upper arm changes only the camber, but 6th gen have a full arm working as knuckles. It could change the actual angle of the arm, thus change the toe?

Now note below that there is no "knuckle type - the arm itself holds the hub/drum.

BlueEM2

iTrader: (1)

LoL so much for me pretending to be a suspension expert.. lots of good advice here now I think I'll stick to engine stuff from now on

lazlong

Yes, upper and lower adjustable arms are needed to adjust toe like that. Right now the front of the wheels are pointing towards the outside of the car and adjusting the arms to push the rear of the wheels out solves that. Numbers #4, 9, and 10 need to be replaced with adjustable ones: http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=1998336

Basically it's buy adjustable arms for $200 or buy a whole new suspension package (OEM) for just the rear for about $1000. Check here for good aftermarket parts dealers: http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=1998336

BTW:I don't know if they make adjustable for the 7th gens but they do make aftermarket ones that are reported to lenghten or shorten that piece. They replace this part of the arm:

*Notice the star bolts. I hate star bolts. lol.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

Lazlong, note that OP is 6th gen - rear is similar, but diff enough to mind a thought. our toe adjustment bolt is right at your forearm.

lazlong

Yeah, it only adjusts +/-1 degree, right? Is that enough when you drop it? I've got spring sag (again) and I needed the adjustable uppers with +/-3 degrees.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

?
non, the arms are supposed to adjust only the camber, they are almost straight above the same line as the toe bolt mounting bolts, so the upper arm in the 7th are not supposed to provide much toe changes. they are supposed to change mostly camber, aside the trailling arm bushings deflection.

The toe excentric bolts will just change the angle of the rear "knuckle/hub".

Trailing arm (hub/knuckle, toelinks removed)


An extended toe link will make the rear camber go up (negatively) by forcing the trailing arm out, shorter will reduce neg camber
On the 6th gen, the trailing arm itself is the "knuckle/hub", so you need to push the trailing arm out ior in to adjust toe, i would guess, unless the bolt indicated a s 14mm above is excentric.

lazlong

I understand about the camber on the upper arms. Whether the hub is bolted on or is the trailing arm itself they act the same- they both pivot at the front of the trailing arm when you increase or decrease the length of the upper and lower arms (toe). What I'm saying is if it's extreme and you try to adjust toe with the lower arm only it won't work. You have to adjust the top arm also.

I think we have 2 people who know what they're talking about going around in circles. I hope your getting this angelassassin. Anyways, follow the link for parts.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

^ lol! yeah!

lazlong

Show me more of that exhaust pipe/muffler. Why the crazy bends?

barbixy

I'm sorry for this question, but I just got a nice 98 Civic HX, and would like to lower it. I have no clue where to start, or how to even do that. I'm not a mechanic, so I was wondering if someone can recommend a shop in LA or Orange county who does this kind of work, and knows how to do it right?
thank you in advance, for any suggestions.