Phantomd

Working on a 98 Civic LX with the 5 speed.

it started throwing the P0335 code (Crank Position Sensor) so I replaced the crank position sensor near the crank... crappy job, mostly just time consuming. Well, I should have done my research since those sensors typically never fail, and the code came back.

I followed the procedure in the FSM to check the sensor. Only then did I realize that the real crank position sensor is in the Distributor, and the one next to the crank is just to verify the crank is moving (at least thats my understanding)

everything checked out fine, I drove the car again and the code came back... This time is started dyeing at lights and stop signs. According to my ScanGaugeII it was idling at around 450-550rpms, sometimes as low as 350rpms

Next I replaced the Distributor cap and rotor, they were in very bad shape, again the code came back.

I removed the throttle body and cleaned out the IAC valve and butterfly on the throttle body and everything went to hell.

after re-assembling the car started and immediately started to run rough and died shortly after. Codes were P0335 (crank sensor) and P0113 (intake air high temp) and P1509 (IAC valve circuit failure) and the car will no longer start. I did remove both of those connectors in the cleaning process, but they were connected when I got these codes...

I then removed the airbox again and re-checked all the connections, still wont start, and I have been unable to get the codes to show again since it wont start... so I have no idea if they are still valid.

I did multiple re-sets of the ECU throughout this process, but the whole IAC and throttle body cleaning was done with the battery connected, but the car off.




SO... any advice?

I have a new distributor on it's way, hopefully it will run after I replace that?

ezone

Be aware that cheap aftermarket distributors are cheap for a reason.

Sometimes it takes 3 or 4 before they finally send you a good one. Makes you really want to pull your hair out and seriously doubt your sanity.
Check what they send you, see if it looks like someone already tried it and sent it back.
If it actually runs without setting any codes, the timing will be too far off to set right.
Need another distributor. Again.
Can you tell I have been through this before?

OEM for me.


Get a fresh O ring for the base of the distributor where it goes into the head.

Phantomd

good advice, it's a cardone unit (rockauto.com) My limited understanding is that cardone is a good brand?

ezone

Google

a1cardone junk

and

a1 cardone review

Phantomd

One interesting fact that was not very clear in all my searches (I will add it here if anyone finds this) is that this 6th generation civic with the D16Y7 motor (and probably others) is that there are two crank position sensors. One in the distributer which would traditionally be called the CAM position sensor, and then the one under the timing belt cover. After extensive research the sensor that actually looks at the crank is a CKF "Crank Fluctuation sensor" and the one in the dizzy is what honda refers to as the CKP or CranK Position sensor. So throwing the code (P0335, P0336) for a crank position sensor is actually pointing to the distributor, and a code P1336, P1337 is the code that points to the CKF (crank fluctuation sensor) or what the rest of the world would call the crank position sensor (as well as all the auto parts stores) The factory service manual for the car makes this very clear when you pay attention to the trouble code troubleshooting flowchart (Pages 11-110, and 11-117)

I will reply to this thread when I fix the car (unlike the rest of the posts I have found out there) I do believe the Dizzy is the issue, and according to a very well respected mechanic on another forum, The distributors are a common issue on these older hondas.

ezone

Yes, please post your fix.
Yes, the distributors are a common problem area, many different components inside it to go bad and the only way do change any of them is to replace the entire thing.



The crank sensor that is positioned at the crankshaft timing gear is used for misfire detection. On some of the engines it has nothing to do with ignition, while on others it has everything to do with ignition.

Phantomd

YAY! updates!

A new distributer fixed it!

It would not even start, it would turn over just fine (battery was on a charger) but not even an attempt to actually start. Once I replaced the distributer it fired right up...

I did not have a timing light, so I very carefully marked the block so I could line it up with the new dizzy... far from a perfect solution, but I had to track down who I lent my timing light too.

the other codes did not show up after replacing the distributer. the idle was around 550 once warmed up, it seemed a bit low... but it could be the computer re-learning, or the timing was slightly off?

ezone

Yay!
Yes, set timing the correct way first and then let it learn.

Phantomd

Yeah, Once I get my timing light back I will check it. and besides the slightly low idle it runs great.