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With the Emanage you can Adjust the fuel and ignition timing curves this is true...vtec change point on emanage ultimate or VAFC2. I have installed the Stage 2 cam and at stock idle it WILL idle real rough and try to cut off on you. Tuning the VAFC did help it not want to cut off at idle, but when idle at night the headlights dim out every time the cam turns over... I have the Apexi super grounding system & Optima yellow top battery so it is not cause of lack of elec. system. Just saying that it seems to get it to idle where it will not shake the sh*t out of you it has to be set at 1000rpm. Tuning the VAFC on a dyno did little more that help idle a LITTLE bit. Dezod is right you can run this cam with the VAFC2 or Emanage...just telling you you probably not like it too much. I HATE the way mine is now.....only way to make it purr like a kitten is EMS. Just my $.02. All I know is that if I knew the driveability issues and what is needed to get it running right i would have NEVER bought the stage 2 cam. I am sure I am not the only one with this cam that has thought this.
Have you tried adjusting the idle??
Just give it like extra 200 rpms and let it sat at 850-900 rpm. It should resolve problem with dimming lights, and possibly stalling...
To adjust the idle you dont need EMS or e-manage.
Find DIY on it in these forums.
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Im not saying I could make 300 whp on 5 psi by any means. But 200 whp on 5 psi doesnt sound impossible for a t3/t4 60 trim, stage 3 turbo cam, valve springs, intake manifold, 450cc injectors, aem ems, full mandrel bent exhaust, cleaned up combustion chambers, port matching, stock compression ratio, headstuds, blockguard, rodbolts. My idle is also high, like 1200 rpm, It cant go any lower on the ems for some reason. It idles smooth so maybe its a problem elsewhere. It spools descent at about 3500 and pulls to about 7300. With higher boost it probably wouldnt hit peak boost untill probably 5500-6000 rpm. Im telling you that the cam was a huge improvement, I bet it was around a 15-20 whp increase. I was just stating that I dont believe a fully built d17 turbo is incapable of 300 whp. I know what it takes to get that much man, its not easy.
Im not saying I could make 300 whp on 5 psi by any means. But 200 whp on 5 psi doesnt sound impossible for a t3/t4 60 trim, stage 3 turbo cam, valve springs, intake manifold, 450cc injectors, aem ems, full mandrel bent exhaust, cleaned up combustion chambers, port matching, stock compression ratio, headstuds, blockguard, rodbolts. My idle is also high, like 1200 rpm, It cant go any lower on the ems for some reason. It idles smooth so maybe its a problem elsewhere. It spools descent at about 3500 and pulls to about 7300. With higher boost it probably wouldnt hit peak boost untill probably 5500-6000 rpm. Im telling you that the cam was a huge improvement, I bet it was around a 15-20 whp increase. I was just stating that I dont believe a fully built d17 turbo is incapable of 300 whp. I know what it takes to get that much man, its not easy.
Need to see the curves.....and know the specs. I hear ya about a fully built D17 being able to break 300, but there are a ton of hurdles to tackle before that can be done. IM, Fuel Delivery, Axles, Tranny.......Those are just a few.
__________________ Constantly redefining the 7thgen Civic's performance... Dezod Motorsports.
block im guessing should be ok for the 300 mark. The trans will possibly hold with the right clutch and for dyno numbers you can use the stock axles. Now, laying down the power at the track under heavy loads, that wont be easy.
I agree. I have lots of connections as far as drivetrain goes but IDK what the future will hold for this car. We built an h22 turbo and got 405 to the wheels on 16 psi for way less than what I have into this car right now, I dont know how much more Im willing to dish out. Its a fun driving, reliable car and I may just leave it at that, and start with something better. They said it was just over 200whp, I will hafta see the charts tomorrow. I will post them reguardless of how good, or crappy they might be.
anyone got this worked out yet. i am wanting to do the stg2 cam and springs and PnP the head along with a cam gear and vafc2. that was the origonal plan but after reading this i am very skeptical. i dont want my daily to drive all funky. so from what i understand the comp doesnt like the settings that you hacked with the vafc and the emanage. i wonder why the comp doesnt act up as much when under boost. there was someone that mentioned using a missing link. has anyone tried this yet??? man i am ready to do this but am wanting more solid answers about the way these things make us idel and run. i dont want to have to keep on the pedal at a light just to keep her idling or deal with the horrible vibration most sepak of. i ahev been in cammed cars plenty of times and no one that i have riden in has had these problems after they were tuned. has anyone tried the GUDE performance cam yet?????
i just got off thephone with Bill Gude of Gude performance. he has a full head package that he does for the d17 the includes a full PnP, racing valve grind ported throttle body and cam. he claims 40whp gain and that the average dyno he has done with this package yeilds 149whp. he quoted me $1250 for the whole package which doesnt seem too bad at all for what you are getting. i was wondering if anyone has had any experience with this guy or his work. he claims to have done this package on 100+ d17's in socal with great results. he also states that he has no drivability issues or idle issues with his set up and it will run great and produce those numbers with out any ecu tuning. just bolt it on and go.
just wondering opinions on this and also if anyone has experienced these guys work?
i could give a fvck if you like me or not so next time you wanna send me some rep, have the balls to put ur name there (even though i can se everyones name who leaves me rep anyway).....oh and good job hiding it in a thread that you didnt post in. your not on my level.
i just got off thephone with Bill Gude of Gude performance. he has a full head package that he does for the d17 the includes a full PnP, racing valve grind ported throttle body and cam. he claims 40whp gain and that the average dyno he has done with this package yeilds 149whp. he quoted me $1250 for the whole package which doesnt seem too bad at all for what you are getting. i was wondering if anyone has had any experience with this guy or his work. he claims to have done this package on 100+ d17's in socal with great results. he also states that he has no drivability issues or idle issues with his set up and it will run great and produce those numbers with out any ecu tuning. just bolt it on and go.
just wondering opinions on this and also if anyone has experienced these guys work?
Im sorry but thats hardly true. 40whp is K series or a good B series cam with all that work. You will get about 17-20whp tops from that.
"he also states that he has no drivability issues or idle issues with his set up and it will run great and produce those numbers with out any ecu tuning. just bolt it on and go."
That is a sign that hes telling you something thats not right. There is no plug and play internal engine work with no tuning.
Edward
the same thing was going through my mind when i talked to him. i question the fact that the car will ever produce 40whp gain form those mods w/o any tuning. with a good tune i see it being possible. not saying it can or cant be done but it is plausable. i ahve been round and round about what to do with this car. first i was all about throwing my t3/t4 for my s10 on it but an finding out to do it right with out doing the fab work myself its going to be about $3k+ to finish it up easily. so i was then contemplating going n/a with the crower stg 2 shizz. but after reading this thread i dont think i want to buy a $1500 EMS just to make it run right. that would be about $3k too just for headwork and tune. i would rather boost for that price and get more power. so i am at my whits end right now trying to figure out what i want to do. a swap has been on my mind as well but i am not paying $7-8k for the 200hp that i can make with a turbo around $3-3500. so the guys that are tuning this cam please get this worked out easily so i can just make up my mind.
ive been talking to a few guys around here. dynamic autosports and also portflow. ill be doing the crower set up and head work with a emanage and cam gear. and i will have the car dyno'd before and after. its going to be about a month or so but it is going to happen. i am going to shoot for 40whp since everyone thinks it cant be done. and truehonda i bet your right knowing you have way more experience with this motor. but that is the goal i bet i can at atleast get close with good tuning.
Getting close with PNP and a great exhuast is possible. Look at the ANR header on the B series. Yeilds 10whp more from just the header. Plus SOHC heads flow really good due to their simpler nature than dual.
well you can see my mod list already. i do have a good flowing system right now. i actually am getting a killer price from dynmaics on the parts less than $600 for cam, springs and retainers. they send the head to portflow for the pNp and valve grind. ill be using a AEM cam gear and emanage to tune. maybe a bigger set of injectors as well depending on the fuel demand. i am shooting ofr 150whp. my clutch should allow me to put down some better #'s as well. i will be doing a headswap with this set up converting from a a1 head to an a2 using the emanage to control the vtec engagement and hopefully advancing the timming a bit with the cam gear. keep your fingers crossed guy if i can pull this off i have a feeling that a lot more people will go this route as well. dynamic has a inhouse dyno and emanage tech. they really know what they are doing when it comes to anything import. they have their own cars that are nothing to bauk at. ill keep everyone posted and keep yopur fingers crossed for me that everything all works out!!!!!
crower cams will ONLY work in a d17a2 engine because that engine has a different cam. and you can look on crower.com for what they claim as gains in hp.
call local junkyards for a d17a2, just ask them if they have any 01-05 civics with an engine that runs good and then go check out if its lx or ex. dont let them know how bad you want the engine though.
back from the dead for some dyno info. should be better after I get emanage and tune it on the dyno.
I upped my n20 shot to 75 for this dyno day, since everyone else uses 75 shot for thier runs.
vids are in my gallery.
133.48 whp 117.57 tq all motor
188.87 whp 187.99 tq 75 shot.
__________________ 133.48 whp 117.57 tq all motor untuned dynojet
188.87 whp 187.99 tq 75 shot n20 untuned dynojet
147.5 hhp 130.5 htq all mtr tuned church's dynapack
my old d17 set up.
now swapped k20a2 4.7fd lsd kpro
Last edited by djmota; 03-25-2006 at 09:52 PM.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost
this is with an untuned cam gear. the vafc2 is tuned but that is just wot fuel.
the emanage will allow some ignition timing adjustment that is needed badly. Also it will allow me to run k20a3 injectors. I have a feeling that my stock ones are maxed out.
__________________ 133.48 whp 117.57 tq all motor untuned dynojet
188.87 whp 187.99 tq 75 shot n20 untuned dynojet
147.5 hhp 130.5 htq all mtr tuned church's dynapack
my old d17 set up.
now swapped k20a2 4.7fd lsd kpro
back from the dead for some dyno info. should be better after I get emanage and tune it on the dyno.
I upped my n20 shot to 75 for this dyno day, since everyone else uses 75 shot for thier runs.
vids are in my gallery.
133.48 whp 117.57 tq all motor
188.87 whp 187.99 tq 75 shot.
this is good news man that means that my numbers of 140-150whp are very easily attainable. especially with the IM swap i am doing with a similar set up. right on oscar. you have renewed my faith. i was starting to get a bit discouraged again.
