herbiej

Hello all, first time poster here, I recently bought a 02 civic "with a small antifreeze leak" as the PO stated. Well the leak is coming out of the radiator overflow bottle and after doing a lot of research here and elsewhere along with a few checks myself, I believe I need to change the head gasket. Coolant is being forced out of the radiator with cap off and slightly revved up.I changed the radiator cap simply because it was a cheap thing to do to rule that out. So to my question, I have watched a couple of you tube videos of the head gasket replacement and they all removed the intake manifold first. My question is to anyone who has done this job, can you easily remove the head with the intake manifold attached? Or do you have to remove the intake? The reason why you ask; it looks like the bolts are pretty hard to get to to remove the intake, it seems to look easier to remove it and replace it as a unit. What say you? Thanks,herbie

drhawkinz

No you don't have to take off the manifold but not sure about the air intake. I would assume with the stock air box you might have to take that out but not sure. It would probably help just so you have more room to work and so you can get the water pipe loose that runs around that side of the engine.

If you follow the DIY in here it has pretty good pictures and instructions on what to do.

https://www.civicforums.com/forums/1...t-diy-2-a.html

herbiej

Thanks for the link, actually I am pretty meticulous on maintaining my cars and the first thing I did when I got the car home was replace the timing belt, tensioner pulley,spring, water pump,cam seal, crank seal,valve cover gasket and spark plug well seals and thermostat. I wish I knew about the need for the longer tensioner bolt as I pulled a couple of threads out when torquing the bolt down. I ordered the longer bolt and loaded it down with red threadlocker and fortunately it torqued down to 34 ft lbs.
If I knew before hand about the head gasket I would have waited but oh well. I am going to try and leave the timing stuff intact and just remove the cam sprocket with belt and when the head gasket gets replaced slip it back on.

ezone

Lift the spring off its peg so the tensioner pulley can relax then slip the timing belt off starting at the tensioner pulley.
No need to take cam gear off this way.

Reinstall in reverse order..
Easy
HTH

herbiej

Thanks ezone, I was trying to avoid removing all that stuff again, but it will be best to do i'm sure so thats what I will do. If I remove the spring and not loosen the tensioner bolt will it still relax or do I have to loosen the bolt too?

drhawkinz

it should take some slack out of the belt so you don't have to remove the tensioner then you can clip the belt off the camshaft.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

Just to reinforce, but my head came off with the intake attached. Of course everything above throttle body removed, but manifold attached was no issue.

ezone

The tensioner pulley is always floating, always able to adjust under spring tension.

You do not have to touch the bolt, just take the spring off its peg so the pulley can relax and you can slip the belt off..

herbiej

Thank you all, That answered my questions, I ordered my HG from Majestic Honda last night, repair manual should be here in a day or two. After reading a lot here on the subject I plan on reusing the head bolts. I thought all head bolts were TTY but guess I am wrong. Thankfully I don't have to do these big jobs too often, thanks again for the advice. herbie

herbiej

I started on my disassembly tonight, got quite a bit done in a couple of hours.

When I started on the timing belt removal and went to remove the spring from the peg nothing happened, no movement, I tried pulling on the belt and nothing, so I removed the cam sprocket with the belt to get it off.
Is there a problem with my tensioner or is this the way it works with the bolt having to be loosened before the tensioner will relax?

Also my crankshaft seal is still leaking,do you need to use OEM Honda seal on here for it not to leak? I will remove it tomorrow and inspect the crank for scoring. Does the seal need to be installed with gasket sealer around the outside circumference? I used a little oil on it and it seemed to slip in too easily.

The seal I bought came in my timing belt kit, it was a Stone seal made in Japan.

Thanks for any help!

ezone

As stated earlier, the tensioner is free to float and move, you only need to release the spring, you do not touch the bolt ---

IF it was installed correctly.

If it wasn't installed right, the stop peg could be in the wrong spot keeping it from having all the movement it should.


OE is the most reliable IMO.

I'll guess you probably won't find anything there, that has not seemed to be a problem from what I've seen.
Nope, outer part needs to be dry.
Inner lip should get a light smear of engine oil if there is no grease already in it.
How did it compare to the original seal?

herbiej

I went out to look at my tensioner and sure enough it moves both directions by hand with spring off. It feels a little stiff,not sure if that is the way it is suppose to feel. When you take the spring off the peg will it relax on its own normally or do you have to pull the belt?

I'm not sure if the old seal was OEM or not it was leaking too. But it looked similar to my seal. I have installed many a seals and have never had one slip in this easy, maybe without the oil on it it will fit a little better,don't know.
Thanks, ezone

ezone

The tensioner pulley is supposed to have a lot of drag in the pivoting section, it's heavily dampened but it still moves fairly freely once the spring is off of it. Belt tension alone moves the pulley, and it will move to its travel limit when you try to push the belt to the side (off the pulley or gear).

You positive it's the seal? Not the oil pump O ring between pump and block or something?

Parts catalog has the brand name ARAI on the seal.

herbiej

Okay I think mine is operating correct. When I installed the tensioner I looked it over to see if there was an alignment pin and since I didn't see one I installed it with the hole for the spring facing in the direction it needs to be and moved on.

After inspecting things again I think I understand how it is suppose to be now. When you get the new tensioner it has a granade pin in it. You mount the pulley like I did with the spring hole facing the spring peg on the block,install belt,torque tensioner bolt, turn crank counterclockwise just a little to put slack on tensioner side and slip spring over peg on block,then pull grenade pin. It looks like the grenade pin holds open the two tabs on the pulley so they will be in the correct location for the stop on the block. Does this sound correct?

herbiej

this is the kit I bought;


http://www.ebay.com/itm/361000841294?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

ezone

Sounded good to me LOL

herbiej

Just finished HG job and will post results in a couple of days.

ezone, I need your help on this timing belt tensioner, when I remove the spring, the belt is tight and you cannot get the tensioner to move. I removed the cam sprocket to get belt on and off. When belt is installed and the marks I made on the belt are aligned and spring is back on it looks the like the tensioner is hitting the stop so I removed the spring and it is still hitting the stop.

Do I need to loosen the bolt and align the two holes in the tensioner again?

Is the smaller hole tab suppose to move after install because mine doesn't?Or does the bolt torqued down stop it from moving?

I am wondering if the red threadlocker I used seeped into the tensioner locking things up,not sure. I done probably about 6 timing belt jobs now and have never had this kind of problem.
Help!
I am waiting to do anything until I get a response because I really don't want to loosen the tensioner bolt unless I have to as I think I will have to time sert it if I mess with it again. herbie

herbiej

I watched a couple of you tube videos of the action of the tensioner when the belt and spring are removed and it looks like mine may just be stuck from the threadlocker so I went in with a screwdriver and gently worked it back and forth until it broke free. Now all is well, thanks anyway, I will post up the results of the HG job when I have put a couple hundred miles on it.Thanks,herbie

ezone

Sorry, I was at work today. Glad you figured it out.

herbiej

You mean you actually have a day job,I thought as much as you help people here that this was your job.

Just kiddin, I appreciate your help, herbie

ezone

I gotta pay for internet!

herbiej

I just finished my head gasket repair on my 2002 Honda civic LX and wanted to share my experience in the hope it may help someone. I know with all the info on this on here and elsewhere it is like beating a dead horse but maybe someone will see something that may help so here goes.

At 54 years old I have done a lot of mechanic work over the years out of necessity more than anything,and I would say if you have some mechanical ability this job is not that hard to do,just kind of tedious and time consuming.
The most important thing to do at the git go is label everything,I used painters tape and marked all electrical and vacuum connections with a #1 to #1, #2 to #2 and so on.

As far as disassembly goes I decided to leave the intake manifold attached to the head for removal and I have to say that was a good decision,it worked out well for removal and installation both. I did not even take the manifold off at all, I did my cleaning and measurements on the head with the intake manifold attached and never removed which saved on the gasket cost. I would have to remove it though if the head was going to the machine shop.

I also did not seperate my exhaust manifold from the pipe, just went under the car and popped the rubber hanger off the peg and removed exhaust manifold bolts and pulled a little towards the front of the car and let it rest there. Worked out nice and no leaks when finished.

The cylinder head is the most critical part,it has to be clean and flat. Thank you to ezone who gave me the advice to use a razor blade for cleaning. I watched a couple of you tube videos on guys cleaning aluminum with a razor blade before I started on it. That worked real sweet just be very careful not to nick or scratch the surface.Then use brake cleaner to clean it up nice,just be careful and spray a rag with the brake cleaner and not the head as that stuff is bad on rubber and if you get some on your valve seals it may damage them, which a couple of valves will be in the open position.

Then when you do your measurements find or buy a good quality straight edge and have a good feeler guage handy. Watch some you tube videos on how to measure,its really pretty easy. When I measured mine I was pleasantly surprised as to how flat the surface was. I could not slip a .002 feeler guage in anywhere.

As far as which head gasket to buy I bought the factory OEM Honda HG. If I would have checked the head first I probably would have bought the mls (multi - layer- steel) gasket by fel-pro,because my head was so flat the mls would have worked great. I also bought a new exhaust manifold gasket and water manifold gasket and block drain crush washer all OEM Honda.

When you remove the water manifold leave the bolt in that secures the metal pipe to the manifold as not to compromise the sealing of the o ring. Just remove the clamp and rubber hose at the end of the pipe.

As far as assembly goes, be sure and clean the block in the same way you cleaned the head. Run a good tap down the head bolt holes and be sure to blow all the head bolt holes out with compressed air as you don't want any oil or coolant down there from head removal. It will throw off your torque values. I reused my head bolts, if you do this be sure to clean them well. Whether you reuse them or buy new be sure to put a little oil on the threads and on top at the washer end,just don't over do it you don't want oil filling up the bolt cavity.

Setting the head is a little tricky, I did it by myself with a flashlight in my mouth shining down the bolt hole trying to align it. It would make the job a lot easier if you have a hand during this process, but its not that difficult as I did it by myself. I have in the past cut the head of an old bolt, used a dremel and cut a cross way notch in the bolt then screw the bolt in the head as an alignment tool and when the cylinder head is on all you have to do is use a screwdriver in the slot you made in the bolt and unscrew the old bolt.

Once that is all done its just a matter of putting everything back.

I did the whole job in a few days work and maybe 10-12 hours (not sure as I didn't keep track) I spent a total of $54 on the head gasket job and about $200 on the timing belt job so the total would be $254.
I have put about 120 miles on it and drove lots of highway speed to test it and the coolant in the radiator is still at the top. Yahoo!

bsmiley

Thanks for sharing, this encourages me that if I blow the HG I will be able to fix it myself without breaking the bank.