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The AC shop said they did get the clutch to engage.
I know, I read that before.
but maybe I didn't do it right.
Are you trying to put power into the car harness instead of the compressor plug?
With the compressor unplugged:
You would short the 2 outer wires on the car harness side to fool the system into thinking the thermal protector is ok. (You only need to do this if you want the whole system enabled.)
You would need to put power into the other half of the connector (compressor side, center wire) to power up the compressor clutch.
Diagram? (Found in a GIS, not 100% sure of accuracy)
I know, I read that before.
Are you trying to put power into the car harness instead of the compressor plug?
With the compressor unplugged:
You would short the 2 outer wires on the car harness side to fool the system into thinking the thermal protector is ok. (You only need to do this if you want the whole system enabled.)
You would need to put power into the other half of the connector (compressor side, center wire) to power up the compressor clutch.
Diagram? (Found in a GIS, not 100% sure of accuracy)
Also found this on the same page
No, I put tried to put power to the compressor clutch side of the connector. But the contacts are very small and it is conceivable that my probe didn't actually make good connection to it.
My thinking was that the thermal protector was on the compressor and mounted in series, so if it was nonfunctional then there is no way you could engage the compressor by running power down that center wire. By the diagram this is not the case and there is a blu/red wire running from the underhood fuse box that will engage the clutch if I send power down it. Perhaps this is how the shop engaged the clutch.
BTW, the AC shop spent its time trying to find a "short," so it sounds like you know a lot more about how this system works than they do.
I'll try the self-diagnosis you describe
Thanks again
EDIT-- tried the self-diagnosis -- the AC light does not come on, even though the system activates the ventilation fans at different speeds. The light itself is working because it shows green if you push it with the fan on and engine running, but the clutch does not engage. The recirc light does not blink after going out after 2 secs.
EDIT AGAIN--- the blu/red wire is the wire on the car side of the connector from which 3 red wires go to the compressor
Last edited by pantdino; 04-12-2015 at 02:33 PM.
Reason: added info
Um....then I'd go to the clutch relay,
see if it clicks when you do the above.
Then check the fuse that runs the clutch (#1)
Then....
Then.....
I usually just pull the relay out to check what's going on with the 4 terminals underneath it. Test light (mine only draws about 50mA so it won't hurt electronics on this test) and/or voltmeter as necessary.
I can check this in about 10 seconds, if all is well I'd see my test light light up on 2 powers and 2 grounds. If your clutch is open then one of the 'grounds' at the relay socket would be missing.
So the relay is fed by 2 fuses supplying power to it.
The PCM controls ground to one side of the relay coil
The clutch is the remaining connection on the 'contacts' set of pins.
Here's a basic generic diagram
Where they have the jumper placed in the pic across 3 and 5, would engage the clutch on yours --if all was well.
So #3 and 5, one terminal has power from a fuse and the other terminal goes to the clutch.
#1 and 2, one has power from a different fuse, the other would be grounded whenever the PCM turns the relay on.
Jumping 3 and 5 in the socket with the engine running causes the driver's side cooling fan to come on but the clutch does not engage
I have power at BOTH 1 and 2 in the socket for that relay -- so if the PCM turns the system on by completing a ground, it is not. (With the relay in place pushing the AC switch does not cause the fan to come on.)
EDIT-- I THINK THE ABOVE REFERS TO THE WRONG RELAY-- IT REFERS TO THE ONE WITH THE AC AND FAN SYMBOLS ON THE FUSEBOX COVER
FOR THE RELAY WITH JUST THE AC SYMBOL I HAVE POWER AT BOTH 3 AND 5 AND ONLY 1 OF 1 AND 2. JUMPING 3 TO 5 DOES NOT CAUSE THE CLUTCH TO ENGAGE
My thinking was that the thermal protector was on the compressor and mounted in series, so if it was nonfunctional then there is no way you could engage the compressor by running power down that center wire.
Only on 2001. 2001 has a single wire connector on the compressor.
On 2002 and later the thermal protector is in series with the pressure switch, thus 3 separate wires at the compressor..
BTW, the AC shop spent its time trying to find a "short," so it sounds like you know a lot more about how this system works than they do.
To those that don't know, EVERY electrical problem must be a "short". It lets those of us in the know know just how much they know. OTOH people who don't know anything about electricity almost always can relate to hearing the word 'short', so it makes non-technical explanations possible.
recirc light does not blink after going out after 2 secs.
So no codes...?
EDIT AGAIN--- the blu/red wire is the wire on the car side of the connector from which 3 red wires go to the compressor
I did not double check wire colors of the diagram I found.
Originally Posted by pantdino
Jumping 3 and 5 in the socket with the engine running causes the driver's side cooling fan to come on but the clutch does not engage
Only on 2001. 2001 has a single wire connector on the compressor.
On 2002 and later the thermal protector is in series with the pressure switch, thus 3 separate wires at the compressor..
To those that don't know, EVERY electrical problem must be a "short". It lets those of us in the know know just how much they know. OTOH people who don't know anything about electricity almost always can relate to hearing the word 'short', so it makes non-technical explanations possible.
So no codes...?I did not double check wire colors of the diagram I found.
Wrong relay!
Comp clutch is the one marked D here
No, no codes flashed
from my EDIT of my prior post (sorry about that-- wrong relay--duh! But at least we know that relay is working. ) :
EDIT-- I THINK THE ABOVE REFERS TO THE WRONG RELAY-- IT REFERS TO THE ONE WITH THE AC AND FAN SYMBOLS ON THE FUSEBOX COVER
FOR THE RELAY WITH JUST THE AC SYMBOL I HAVE POWER AT BOTH 3 AND 5 AND ONLY 1 OF 1 AND 2. JUMPING 3 TO 5 DOES NOT CAUSE THE CLUTCH TO ENGAGE
FOR THE RELAY WITH JUST THE AC SYMBOL I HAVE POWER AT BOTH 3 AND 5 AND ONLY 1 OF 1 AND 2. JUMPING 3 TO 5 DOES NOT CAUSE THE CLUTCH TO ENGAGE
I see the fusebox image I tried to hotlink is not working...try again
The socket for the clutch relay (D) will not have battery power on terminals 3 and 5 at the same time unless you jumpered it.
One terminal of the relay socket in the fusebox (3 or 5) will be powered by fuse #1, the other leads to the clutch. If you unplug the compressor, that terminal should test as an open circuit.
I see the fusebox image I tried to hotlink is not working...try again
The socket for the clutch relay (D) will not have battery power on terminals 3 and 5 at the same time unless you jumpered it.
.
But it DOES have power at both 3 and 5, no jumper applied. I kept checking it because I knew it shouldn't
Where does the center red wire from the connector to the clutch go exactly? (The extension of the blu/red wire shown in the diagram.) Does it go to the clutch coil with nothing in between? If it does then maybe I should try cutting it and applying "for sure" power to it to see if the clutch engages. Again, the contacts in the connector are small so maybe I didn't get power in there properly or maybe the connector is defective somehow.
On the compressor connector the center wire goes to the clutch coil.
On the engine harness side of the compressor connector it comes from the clutch relay.
Don't cut anything, you'll just cause more problems.
I suppose I could splice another wire onto it and put power thru that one rather than cutting the original wire.
Let me clarify one thing:
1) there is only one wire going to the compressor clutch coil, and it is the only way to get power to it. It is the middle red wire from the connector.
2) the AC shop claims they got the clutch to engage
Therefore if I put power to that wire the clutch should engage, no?
1) there is only one wire going to the compressor clutch coil, and it is the only way to get power to it. It is the middle red wire from the connector.
sounds true to me.
2) the AC shop claims they got the clutch to engage
Therefore if I put power to that wire the clutch should engage, no?
"The ohm meter was set to the 200 scale, which is the lowest it has. Meter never budged from 1, which is its display for infinity ohms. when I touch the probes together I get like 0.6 ohms, so I think it would have registered 3-4
This is the car that someone swapped an EX motor into, so I guess it's possible they forgot to connect a ground somewhere."
I seriously wonder if the compressor was not actually engaged at the AC shop and someone just thought it was.
"The ohm meter was set to the 200 scale, which is the lowest it has. Meter never budged from 1, which is its display for infinity ohms. when I touch the probes together I get like 0.6 ohms, so I think it would have registered 3-4
So if the clutch coil is open circuit, it cannot engage.
It should be something like 3-5 ohms (measure between center wire and battery ground)
This is the car that someone swapped an EX motor into, so I guess it's possible they forgot to connect a ground somewhere."
IIRC The coil ground should be bolted to the top of the compressor.
I seriously wonder if the compressor was not actually engaged at the AC shop and someone just thought it was.
Could be. Could be a broken winding in the coil too, or some other intermittent fault in that circuit (component).
04-12-2015
