thewal

Ok so recently its been really cold and in the morning when tryin to start my car with my auto starter it would not even turn the engine. Had to go outside and turn it on with my key. Also noticed that my battery voltage was down to 11.7 volts. When running the alternator is charging at 14.7 volts.
The next day after the car is parked checked the voltage its down to 11.7 volts. The bAttery is 3 years old. Checked a the connection and they are good.
I have a compustar alarm starter combo in the car but i dont think that that would drain it that fast over night.

I do also have an after market kenwood stereo and amp.

Is it the battery thats dying or something is draining it?

What can i do to verify.

Thanks

ezone

Sounds like it is charging ok.....


I would:
Measure the current drain on the battery with an ammeter.
Ideally, drain should be less than 30mA for these cars STOCK.
Add-ons might raise that a little bit, but should still be under 50mA total.

If the draw is excessive, you got some digging to do.
If the draw is not excessive, then the battery is probably just junk.

mikey1

11.7 volts while the battery is sitting is pretty much normal and should be more than enough to start the car.....the car is starting fine with the key?.....if so it sounds like the problem is with the remote starting unit....charging, alternator, and battery all sound fine

thewal

I will do a draw test and report back. What is the best way to do a draw test?

ezone

Bullpoop.

11.7v may as well be dead.

See the HUGE YELLOW CHART in this PDF.:http://www.mmbalmainauto.com.au/PDF/..._batteries.pdf

mikey1

disconnect the positive battery terminal....measure voltage between the positive battery post and the battery wire

ezone

Googled, but did not verify

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ezone

Not voltage.
Amperage.

thewal

It the negative that you test on. Its safer no?

mikey1

yes, sorry....still half asleep here

ezone

always.

EDIT: That word was typed in all caps, but posted as all lower case. WHY CAN'T I YELL?

mikey1

no....you test on the positive for amp draw

thewal

This is when the alarm is not on. How would i test ro see if the alarm is an issue?

ezone

Wrong. It does not matter which side you test on.

Negative is always safer.

mikey1

here is my take from what i have read.....

- the car will not start using the remote starter
- the car WILL START using the key

if both of these statements are true, the problem must have something to do with your remote starter unit, and/or the wiring

ezone

Trip the hood latch so the MICU thinks the hood is closed, roll down a window, put the keys in your pocket, shut the doors.

If the aftermarket alarm has its own hood switch, bypass that too.
Then arm the alarm.

Then test.

ezone

Many of these systems will not allow remote starting if the battery is weak.
The factory accessory remote start systems I install at work say they will do exactly this.

thewal

A little clarification. The remote starter did mot work when it was really cold. -35C
This morning it worked fine it was -20C
But before turning the car on the battery voltage was 11.9v

ezone

Holy poop. I wouldn't want to work either.

When you had to start it manually, did it take a lot of cranking before it ran?
Does the remote start only crank it for like 3 seconds, but it takes 5 or 6 seconds to get the engine to start when it is that freeking cold?

I had a car like this (90 Calais), remote start would give up after trying and failing 3 times. Fired right up if I went and twisted the key for a couple extra seconds longer than the remote could do.

mikey1

okay.....when you made this comment....

"Ok so recently its been really cold and in the morning when tryin to start my car with my auto starter it would not even turn the engine. Had to go outside and turn it on with my key."

i kind of took from that, your remote starter didnt work, but when you went outside and started the car with the key, it started????

ezone

C&P from a user manual for the remote starts I install at work:

The remote engine starter will only operate provided all
the following conditions are met:
• The gearshift lever is in the “P” (Park) position.
• The brake pedal is not depressed.
• The engine hood is securely closed.
• All the doors are closed and locked.
• The tailgate or trunk lid is closed.
• The security warning system is not activated.
• The panic warning system is not activated.
• The keyless entry-integrated key or ignition key is
removed from the ignition switch.
• The battery power is not low.


I gather that all you know for certain is the car didn't start.....But what DID it try to do?
So....at -35* did the remote starter even make an attempt at cranking the engine, or did it do absolutely nothing?

thewal

With the remote start all i hear was a click. Thats it. Then when i turned the cAr on with the key it cranked for about 3 to 5 seconds the. It started.

ezone

You don't know what the click was? Any of a dozen different relays, or the starter solenoid?



Thoughts:

Have the battery tested after it sits overnight. I bet it fails at 11.7v.
Have you tried a fresh battery yet?

Establish if a GOOD battery will allow the car to remote start when its -35* out.

Then figure out if this battery is actually the problem, or if the car has a drain on the battery.

Or if the remote starter has problems of its own. See your installer.

thewal

Yeah. Will have to go get a new battery and start from there.

thewal

One thing i did also notice is the level of fluid in the battery was a little low. Some had as low as 2 inch from the top. Is that normal?

ezone

Manufacturers normally leave quite a bit of room for electrolyte levels to change without exposing the cell plates.

Can you open the lids and see if the cell plates are exposed? (If they are permanently sealed, forget it.)

Observe all standard safety precautions, that is sulfuric acid in there.

If the plates are not fully submerged in liquid (acid) and exposed, that battery is probably junk.

thewal

So I took a video of a amp draw that i did today, with the alarm on,
here is the link to the video.
http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?...ature=youtu.be
I am not an electrical expert have a look and let me know please.
Initially when i connected the multimeter leads the amperage seemed hi but then dropped significantly.

ezone

You failed at copy-pasta the link. Had to edit.
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If I read your work right, I'd think that was around 65mA. About double what I like to see on a stock, unmolested car.....The factory security system doesn't draw that much.
65mA is less than a single peanut #194 bulb like in the trunk light.

65ma is a little high but it would take considerable time to bring a good battery down.

If a fully charged battery will last (guess) 3 weeks at 30mA drain before it won't start the car......I'd guess this 65mA drain would pull a brand new battery down in a week and a half or so. (I'm GUESSING here.) No, it shouldn't kill a good battery overnight.

EDIT: I forgot to factor in the extreme cold you have up there. Still ok for the example though.

But if you have a battery that is weak/marginal/not fully charged to begin with, it will be killed all that much faster.



What reading do you get if the aftermarket alarm is not armed?

My first move would be to check draw on just the aftermarket stuff alone, see if that is the source. I would use an inductive ammeter (amp clamp), but you would just pull fuses, disconnect power wires to the unit, or disconnect the control unit and stuff (I have no idea what all could be there.)
IF you think you need to chase it.

I'd probably test the battery, and see if a good batterry makes the remote start work first.

thewal

my car has a aftermarket compustar alarm starter combo.
when i did the draw test without the alarm the other day if my mind serves me right it was around 45milliamps. now when the alarm is on i have 2 led lights blinking inside the car, and one led strip on top if the windshield. you know like the one in knight rider heheh.

I will have to check to see if my aftermarket kenwood deck or Amp is drawing any current. it was -20c when i did the test so i was getting cold. i have had this system in the car for almost ten years never had a problem.

ezone

That explains a lot of the draw.


I think I would probably just experiment with a fresh battery, see if that allows it to start in the extreme cold.