Dave88LX

Looking for a fuel efficient commuter car.

Here is the original ad from Craigslist. Below that, I e-mailed him some questions and got some answers.

So how much realistically should I be able to get this for? Offer? There are some scuffs on the bumper that I know at least at a dealer, are worth getting something knocked off for. Reason for selling is due to a new vehicle, so I would tend to think he is more motivated to sell.

2004 Honda Civic EX for sale. Low mileage car - only 79,000 miles. Excellent condition. Passed MD State Inspection in mid-January, and I have a Car Fax report to provide for next owner. This car still has plenty left in the tank!

- Blue exterior; grey cloth interior
- Automatic transmission
- Front wheel drive - 4 wheel ABS
- Power windows; power door locks
- Power steering
- Dual Front airbags
- Alloy wheels
- Cruise control
- Sunroof
- Keyless entry
- AM/FM/CD player
- Air conditioning
- Excellent gas mileage
- No major accidents; good tires; no engine problems
- Comes with Sirius Satellite Radio (inactive)
- Next oil change is due at 80,000 miles
- It has already passed MD State Inspection - I have the certificate.

Email me with any questions or for more pics. Only notable blemish on car is a surface scratch on front left bumper, small ding on front drivers quarter panel, and normal wear and tear.

Serious inquiries only. Cash, bank or certified check accepted ONLY. Thanks.
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I appreciate the 'original ownerness' and perceived owner honesty of this particular vehicle.

I looked at all the other cars with the same features (04/05, auto, sedan, 80K miles or less, condition etc.) and the lowest priced one is $8,700 upwards of $12,000. Almost makes it hard to tell him it's overpriced as a bargaining tool. How do you go about bargaining on something that is already what is probably fairly priced?

I pulled up comparable vehicles on cars.com. This one at $8,300 is already priced below the local market for anything listed. I'm sure there is some negotiating room down from $8,300, but makes it a harder sell to justify when I can't show lower comps (unless I up mileage etc.)

http://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchr...Id=2102&rd=250




Hi,

I saw the ad for your Civic on CL, I had a few questions for you on it.

- Can you elaborate on 'no major accidents'? I think that implies there is some sort of accident history with it...
Drivers-side mirror was nearly knocked off and there was some scratches also done by someone parrallel parking in the city - I never found out who. I just returned to my car after dinner to find it damaged with no note. Car had to have some minor body work done to repair the damage. That is why I said no MAJOR accidents. You wouldn't even know it if I didn't tell you. The car has never been in a moving accident.

How long have you owned this vehicle?
- I'm the only owner. Leased the vehicle in late 2003 and purchased it after the lease was up.

- Where was it purchased from (state)?
- Leased it at Northwest Honda in Owings Mills, MD.

- Do you have maintenance records?
- Only what is shown on the Car Fax report. There aren't many to report in the first place.

- What issues if any have you had with it?
No major issues. It's a Honda. Very dependable. Biggest problem was that the speedometer malfunctioned in January. It just stopped working and was pinned on 140 mph. I had to have the entire instrument cluster replaced. Instead of buying a new one ($900), I found a used one online which I purchased for a fraction of the cost. But the used speedometer's odemeter couldn't be adjusted during installation. I was lucky I found one that had mileage similar to what was actually already on the car. So...the car has 79K miles on it, but the odometer on the replacement instrument cluster has 77K on it. There was no way for the Honda dealership to synch up the mileage.

- Reason for selling this car?
- I bought a new car for myself.

Could you also send me the higher resolution pictures of the car?
See attachments.

sl33pyriceboi

iTrader: (3)

the going price will be different everywhere...some places that car will go for more, some places it will go for less...

i live in so cal, and my sister jsut bought a 03 EX with 104,000 miles for $6000. fair price.


so my best guest is you will be looking to pay around that ball park as well.

sl33pyriceboi

iTrader: (3)

i would go no higher than 7k

SlimRisk

What about kbb?

Dave88LX

No higher than $7K. Damn. You can't even find them advertised at $7xxx with that 'low' mileage. I'd love to get it for $7K. I'd pay $7500.

sl33pyriceboi

iTrader: (3)

see what i mean when i said different regions will have a differnt going price?

around here (southern california) that car would go for about 7k (would be the average good price)

while i was shopping for my sister's civic, i saw a black version of your car for 6200$. i hesitated and called 2 days later, it was gone.

TouringCivic

If you have a repo-depo in your area you can try to do what i did.

i looked around and found a 2001 honda civic sedan with a minor front end collusion like a bumper and a headlight fixed and i got it for $1200 CAD and fixed it for $1200 CAD and now i got this fly looking power everything civic in my profile pic for $2400+some upgrades i recently added.

DarkSouljur

I bought the same car with pretty much the same mileage for $3500

Rodrigo

In December I bought an '05 Civic LX 5-speed with 162K miles. The young lady selling it was the original owner, but she didn't take great care of it. The oil was black and nearly 2 quarts low, and she ruined a nearly new set of tires by driving her twice-daily 30 minute commute about 10 psi low. It had some dings & scratches, but was in overall acceptable condition. It also has the cracked exhaust manifold, but I'm driving it as-is until I get motivated to pull it out and take it to a welding shop to get brazed.

She was asking a fair price (IMO) of $4900. I gave her $4500. I bought it because I was growing weary of 11 mpg in my F-150.

The car you're considering is a fair bit nicer, and in much better shape. In my area (central IL), I'd be willing to give $6500 - $7000 it.

You must have some kind of magic negotiating powers. My son lives in Riverside, and looked all over to find a reasonable Civic in that price range. He ended up buying a '99 Civic 5-speed for $3000 that requred another $900 to repair the suspension damage and cooling systepm problems caused by the hacks who lowered it.

TouringCivic

This is really odd for me i figured in the US Hondas ran cheap i guess it depends on where in the US but in Canada you can pick up nice Honda's for under $5000.00.

Rodrigo

Count your blessings!

I base this solely on my own observation, but it seems like prices on used compacts went through the roof when gas prices got all crazy. It seems particularly pronounced for Civics & Corollas. I was really glad to get the price I did on my car, but had to be willing to roll the dice a little bit due to condition.

TouringCivic

Ya i guess that makes sense.

Dave88LX

Yeah I've had my eye out for a bit on them. I know that price varies a bit by region, I didn't think the swing would be that bad though.

Here is a listing of all '04-'05 EX 4-door sedan gas-only automatics with under 100K miles, across the U.S. Nothing really in the price range you guys are talking, unless I went higher miles.
http://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchr...02&mlgId=28859


http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/search...100&make=HONDA

got2run5

You guys may call me crazy but in WI that car would easily go for over 10k. Im not sure why cars are so expensive here except that maybe it's hard to find a car without rust from all the salt in the winter.

Dave88LX

He took a deposit on it today. Now I have to start all over again!

got2run5

Not necessarily. Most deposits are fully refundable. I put one down on a car I was around 80% sure I was going to buy but I decided not to and when I told them they had no problem refunding my deposit. Keep an eye on it to see if the person that put money down actually ends up buying it.

Dave88LX

I emailed him back to ask what he got for it, he got $8K.

I looked at another local one. Ended up being a crappy rainy night so I can't tell much. But, this joker is telling me that Hondas are so great and the Civic is hard to find. Um...don't play me for a moron. I'll quickly tell you to **** up a rope and keep your damn Civic.

raigen18

yea the prices are going to vary a lot depending on your location. i say just go with what the average asking price is for you locally and go with that instead of the prices you are getting on this forum.

got2run5

They are hard to find. When I bought mine, there were less than 7 2-door, manual in all of Wisconsin on autotrader.

Dave88LX

So this one is actually in the price range you guys are talking about. I feel like something is wrong with it because it's cheaper! Looks very clean though.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Speci...t_10304wt_1167



Then I saw this one too. Everything looked great until I got to the last line, head gasket just replaced. I feel that implies low coolant, and therefore a lack of maintenance. What else is ready to let go? Looks damn immaculate though.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EX-1-...t_16737wt_1167

Stock 99

Head gasket is a wear part and doesn't necessarily mean poor maintenance. I would be more interested in who replaced it.

Rodrigo

This is precisely the philosphy to havewhen shopping for a used car. If you take your time and make solid decisions about the car to purchase, you're much more likely to feel good about getting a good value when you're done. That's what it's all about, really... feeling like you got a good value for your money.

Another excellent point. If you take the time to talk to your seller, you should be able to tell right away if they know beans about taking care of a car. that doesn't mean you shouldn't buy their car... it's just another variable you have to take into consideration when evaluating it.

Dealers will be very, very good at making a used car look pretty. But is that anything you can't get at a good detail shop for a couple hundred bucks? Or do yourself over the course of a weekend for next to nothing?

I don't know how mechanical you really are, but if you're on this forum you're probably able to evaluate the mechanical needs of a car. That's the most important decision. When I bought my latest Civic it went something like this:

I started the car and popped the hood (it was already warmed up). I put my ear close to the valve cover and listened carefully for any noise. The engine ran smooooooth and happy. I hopped in the drivers seat and took it for a spin around the parking lot to evaluate the clutch. The clutch was good, but I noted a thump-thump-thump sound from one of the rear tires. I looked at & smelled the exhaust coming from the tailpipe.

THEN I pulled the dipstick. The oil was black and I guessed about 2 quarts low. But I was reasonably sure it wasn't it wasn't burning after my examination of the exhaust. I knew the clutch was good, but the tires were bad (despite being nearly new). I asked her if she'd had the timing belt replaced (the car had 162,000 miles on it), and she said it had NOT. She also lamented that she didn't know why the brake light wouldn't go off. I told her it was because she was low on brake fluid and she likely had a leak somewhere.

So I knew if I bought this car I'd immedately be spending 300 - 400 bucks on tires, and another couple hundred on timing belt & water pump. I also assumed the coolant was gonna need a flush & fill and would have to chase down a brake fluid leak. The car was pretty dirty and a little worn looking, but I can clean that up myself.

On the PLUS side, the car had no sign of rust or blistering clear coat (a big problem for older Hondas here in central IL). So I felt good that it would clean up nicely.

I pointed out ALL the things the car needed, and said I'd give her 45 hundred dollar bills for her car. She took it.

I ended up putting in another 600 or so getting maintenance up to date (all done in my garage). So I'm into this car for just over five grand, and feel really good about the value I got.

That's my story, anyways...

Dave88LX

Is that just a Honda thing? I come from the land of Mustangs, V-8s, and diesel trucks. I haven't seen a head gasket let go unless it was due to overheating/low coolant etc. They don't 'wear out'. Also (at least in my experience), a blown head gasket may often result in a warped aluminum head, and sometimes a cracked iron head. I agree with you in 'who replaced the gasket'. It's listed on the CARFAX, I would assume dealer.

Rodrigo

The plastic radiator failed on my son's '95 Civic a couple years ago. It was bad. Loss of coolant and resulting overheat caused a blown head gasket along with lots of other damage (brand new distributor & plug wires melted).

We got it fixed. And it was great afterward.

I don't believe a catastophic overheating scenario automatically means the engine is toast. My opinion...

Dave88LX

Hey thanks for the details on your car buying adventures. Fun huh!


I called the dealer who did the replacement (who incidentally is also the one selling). This guy says he took it in on a trade, and there was oil leaking on the exhaust 'or something', so they took it in and replaced the head gasket 'and probably the water pump/timing belt at the same time'. ("Probably" doesn't mean **** to me.)

I don't know Hondas well enough to know if a head gasket would leak oil externally like that. I don't think they do on V8s that I'm used to.

The whole car is priced high IMO too.

Dave88LX

How was the head? Warped? Replaced/milled?

Stock 99

No, it's not just a Honda thing. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head there though. It's an aluminum head/overheat thing that results in the head warping. The HG is just the failure point. So yes, I would agree with that. Head gaskets don't fail but aluminum heads warp and when that happens you have to replace the HG and mill the head or replace it if too much damage has been done. Overheating can be caused by something as simple as a $10 thermostat sticking, coolant hose leaking or water pump failure. So yes, that could point to an owner that wasn't fully paying attention to the maintenance of their vehicle.

I guess I stand corrected there.

Rodrigo

Unfortunately, I had to pay a mechanic to fix that one... my son was in college over two hours away at that point. We got lucky and found a good one.

You know, I'm pretty sure the head was fine! I spent a lot of time on the phone with the mechanic, and I don't recall him saying there were any problems with the head. And I don't recall seeing any machine shop charges being passed along on the invoice. The expenses for parts weren't real high. Labor charges were a bitch.

Rodrigo

One other thought... if this car is not too far from you, go drive it. Tell the guy you're gonna take it for an afternoon and you don't want his nosy a** bothering you while you have it.

Then drive it back home and check the compression. And whatever else you want. pull tires & check brakes. the works.

And if they want to sell you a car, they'll let you. And if not, tell them to go **** up a rope.

Dave88LX

Well I took a closer look at this one today:
http://www.pasadenamotorsales.com/20..._145799007.veh

First thing I noticed right away was the hail damage on the hood, roof, and trunk. Next thing I noticed was that the rear bumper was a repaint, and the paint coverage wasn't full, pretty shoddy. Took it for a spin anyways. Mechanically I didn't notice anything wrong. I told him his price was way too high, that I had just missed out on a private sale 79K mile '05 with maint. records for under $8K. Let him know I was looking at other cars with similar mileage for thousand or two cheaper. The most they would budge on the price was down to $500 to $8500. I told him that's the reason the car is still on the lot 30 days later, and the other one was gone in 3 days, and good luck with it. Disappointing. He's crazy if he thinks he's going to get that much for a hail damaged car.


I think I'm just going to skip over the head gasket car. I think this is the one I want to look at next, even though the mileage is a bit past what I want, the price is luring me in.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...t_10304wt_1167