yOuNg HoNdA

just trying to get max power and torque out of this engine i need help on things i could do without damaging my engine

MindBomber

A VTEC head swap and a stage 1 cam are the only mods that will give you a significant bump in power for under $1000.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

significant as in 25 to 30 hp

yOuNg HoNdA

if I put a stage 1 cam would I blow pistons or anything
Like that cuz my dad said if I put a cam or anything I would
Have to change pistons, tranny, etc.

And what would a vtec head swap do and what part of the
Engine is that....sorry like I said im new to cars.

I also got a short ram intake...is that good
And what will it do?

MindBomber

A short cam will make your car sound louder and the engine bay look cleaner, maybe add 1-2hp.

The head what sits on top of the engine block under the the valve cover; it contains valves, springs, the cam etc. Switching to the VTEC head would add 10-15 for less than $500, it's definitely an essential step if you plan on doing any performance mods.

A stage 1 cam won't cause any issues and you won't need to change any other parts, if you wanted a stage 2 cam then you would need engine management software, valve springs and retainers. The only time you would ever need to change the pistons is for a major motor build and you'll never need to change the transmission if you have a manual. If you have an automatic you can go pretty far into a motor build without changing it to manual, but 7g civic autos have some mechanical issues that might cause it to fail all on its own.

No disrespect at all to your dad, but what he's suggesting applies more to domestic engines, which have an entirely different approach than Japanese engines.

yOuNg HoNdA

Ok cool, and np.

So if I put a stage 2 cam...what is the engine management
Software? And what are retainers?

MindBomber

Retainers are a part of the head, the factory ones aren't strong enough to support a stage 2 cam.

Engine management system, is actually more appropriate, that was a typo on my part. An EMS allows you to adjust the instructions the ECU sends to the engine.

Stage 1,2 and 3 cams are all $360; the difference in price comes with the fact that stage 2 and 3 cams need $1000+ worth of other parts to make it work.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

let's just make this clear: the cams need the v-tec head to work, and the stage 2 and above does not seem a good indication for you -takes a lot of work to make them work well.

MindBomber

thanks man, I forgot to mention that.

yOuNg HoNdA

ok so
short ram intake
stage 1 cam
vtec head+ valves, springs and retainers right?

im also getting
pullies
and hopefully a whole new exhaust system......anything else i could do to my non racing car.???

MindBomber

No springs and retainers need for the stage 1, all you need is the cam.
Pullies look nice, but they only add about 2hp.

There are tons of relatively inexpensive mods you can do to the suspension and brakes that will make a noticeable improvement in performance, it's just our engine thats hard to get power from.

Welcome to the site btw, we're always glad to welcome new members.

yOuNg HoNdA

o ok well i was told that the pullies made a big difference in take off speed while on the highway and stuff like that. He said that they take alot of stress off the engine and stuff like that. but ya they are nice. as far as handling ima lower my car put a sway bar and get like camber kit and stuff so my wheels wont fold in.

thanks man!

ok now im sorry i have alot of questions. but besides the

vtec head
cam
intake
pullies
new exhaust system

what else can i do to my engine to get horse power?

if nothing, what can i do to get more torque, i would LOVE to have torque!!!!

MindBomber

All depends on your budget..

Pullies might make a difference on some engines, but not this one, seriously even to get 2hp you probably need to go have it tuned on a dyno lol. Other than what we've already talked about, the only things you could do power wise without spending in the thousands are nitrous and maybe a basic EMS to get the most out of your other mods.

Mods that will make a huge difference in performance for little cash would be SS brake lines, Strut Bar, 5th gen prelude front brakes, new struts, energy suspension bushings.

Good inexpensive cosmetic mods are LED climate controls, rear disk conversion, retro-fit headlights, fog lights, painting things (ask mac25 about painting lol)

yOuNg HoNdA

Where the hell am I going to find a place that has a dyno machine thing?????

Lol

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

You dont get your car dyno'd with new pullies. You just waste money on pullies- they are just for looks.

Retainers hold the springs in place- springs are stiffter for the stage 2/3 cams because they are more aggressive and will wear the stock ones out really fast.

An exhaust is really a waste of money until you swap your head to an EX. You can see my exhaust thread in my sig.

I also wouldnt say a HID retro or rear disc conversion is cheap- but hands down, an HID retro is one of the coolest mods you can do to enjoy driving your car- especially at night.

Find out what you hate about your car and then upgrade those things to your liking- thats the best route you can take. If you want your car to look cooler- do cosmetic things, if you want your car to stop faster- upgrade the brakes. If you want more power and torque- swap the head and upgrade the cam, and swap your tranny and upgrade to a lightened flywheel.

MindBomber

I didn't mean that you needed to have you car dyno'd because you put on new pullies, I meant you would need to dyno tune to get the 2hp they might give you.

The only thing worse than pullies is cam gears, both of those mods are expensive and purely engine esthetics.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

^ At least cam gears allow you to advance or retard your timing which you can squeeze a few extra horsepower out of with the right supporting mods.

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

the springs also need to be stronger because the stage 2/3 cams paired with an EMS could get up to 9k rev, and valve fluctuation could be an issue. reatainers are not completely necessary unless fully built engine.

To the OP, the easy ones are already said.
V-TEC head swap, but you need to install some management system to control the V-TEC (more expensive). drop the cam there. Intake and exhaust (good ones).
That's about all that does something on these cars easily.You are already a lot of cash here, note that.
Also, you tranny will blow with anything more than that, so you really need to get another car instead of going any further.
Tha's all. /thread.

b0ssman

I have to dissagree with this,You do not need any tuning for pullies or anything else that relies on making engine parts lighter.Pullies make power(or more accurately free up power) by mechanical means,no amount of fuel/spark/cam angle tuning is going to change their benefits.The only thing you need to tune for is an increase of volumetric efficency or compression.

yOuNg HoNdA

wow wow wow guys hold on... lol ok

im confused now ok
so if i get a V-TEC head swap i will need to install some management system.
whats management system?


to boss man what is volumetric efficency or compression?

sdaidoji

iTrader: (1)

Just a hint: most of your questions have already been answered before lots of times.
One option is using a V-tec harness, but there were easier systems.
Start reading here and keep going
https://www.civicforums.com/forums/7...uestion-s.html
Another:
https://www.civicforums.com/forums/1...plete-fix.html

You know what? there goes the last one and most complete - took me 3 minutes to find them
https://www.civicforums.com/forums/1...p-ex-vtec.html

don't worry, way above your head at the moment.

Now have a good and nice read, and come back with questions of what you did not understand after reading them

yOuNg HoNdA

oooo ok i see now.. thanks man. well i look at the pics and stuff looks hard so i might take it to the shop. ok now one more question

wen i buy a vafcII it will come with everything i need to install the VTEC head right?

MindBomber

That makes complete sense, thank you for correcting me. When I first got into cars I looked into pullies and people were suggesting that you would need to dyno tune to get any actual gains, which has never made much sense to me, but I went with it since I didn't know better. Its a stretch, but tuning for pullies could be compared to tuning for lighter wheels.

b0ssman

yOuNg HoNdA

ok now that i found about the vtec head swap, and follow the instrustions of the link you gave me or take it a shop.

just letting you know JUST incase i didnt say or you didnt know.

i have an 01 civic Lx automatic d17 1.7L with a lil over 101,000 miles.

if i put that head swap and everything else i need for it, plus the cam.
it wont be to much for my transmission and engine right????

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

You dont need engine management for a headswap... you just need a way to control the vtec point (since the LX ECU doesnt have a pin in for vtec). You either do this by swapping the ECU and engine harness, or simply installing a Apexi VAFC2.

I have the exact same car as you and purchased everything for a headswap, but ended up selling the stuff to free up some cash. (if you dont have a vtec head yet, hit me up- I got one with only 50k on it that I took to the machine shop to have all the seals replaced- super clean and ready to bolt on- pics in my forsale thread in my sig)

Parts to get:
Vtec head
Apexi vafc2
new headgasket (for the vtec head aka d17a2)
Optional:
crower stage 1 cam

Your tranny will be completely fine with this power, you dont need to upgrade it at all.

BTW, With a basic tool set and a friend, you can easily complete this head swap.

Brian1037

I've been watching this thread. Thank you for the info everyone Repped you guys (except you mindbomber cause apparently i had already given you some lol)

MindBomber

It's the thought that counts, thanks man.

Always nice to know that the advice we give is appreciated.

b0ssman

Don't forget he'll need a Helms manual...torque specs are important when dealing with the head and if he changes the cam.

MindBomber

^https://www.civicforums.com/forums/1...e-updated.html