Y7 to Y8 Mini Me Swap - ECU install Clarification - Parts Check List for Mini Me Swap
09-21-2009
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Y7 to Y8 Mini Me Swap - ECU install Clarification - Parts Check List for Mini Me Swap Hello,
Ever since I ran into the mini me y7-y8 conversion, I have been reading up on it non stop. I think I have most, if not all of the needed parts to buy. Also, I have put together a pretty handy install guide, borrowed from various forums mini me dyi. However, I am still not absolute on the ECU issue. How to wire it? the knock sensor, etc.. Here is a list of parts needed. Please add/remove and unneeded parts- also ANY clarification on the ecu upgrade would be great!
NEEDED PARTS: ??
-y8 knock sensor
- y8 wiring harness
-D16y8 Head /gasket
-D16y8 Intake Manifold /gasket
-D16y8 Throttle Body /gasket
-D16y8 Fuel Rail
-D16y8 Fuel Injectors
-Exhaust Manifold Gasket
-Timing Belt
- 96-00 civc ex spark plugs
- dizzy ex y8
-Intake
-ECU P2P: 96-00 OBD-2 ex -Vtec Comp - find both o2 sensors- find knock sensor - find install info
-Wire/Wire connectors
-Copper Spray
-Coolant
-Oil/Oil Filter
-Colored Tape- marking- colored markers
-Zip Lock Bags
-Haynes Manual- head stud tightning order- w/ torque lbs. -
Ever since I ran into the mini me y7-y8 conversion, I have been reading up on it non stop. I think I have most, if not all of the needed parts to buy. Also, I have put together a pretty handy install guide, borrowed from various forums mini me dyi. However, I am still not absolute on the ECU issue. How to wire it? the knock sensor, etc.. Here is a list of parts needed. Please add/remove and unneeded parts- also ANY clarification on the ecu upgrade would be great!
NEEDED PARTS: ??
-y8 knock sensor
- y8 wiring harness
-D16y8 Head /gasket
-D16y8 Intake Manifold /gasket
-D16y8 Throttle Body /gasket
-D16y8 Fuel Rail
-D16y8 Fuel Injectors
-Exhaust Manifold Gasket
-Timing Belt
- 96-00 civc ex spark plugs
- dizzy ex y8
-Intake
-ECU P2P: 96-00 OBD-2 ex -Vtec Comp - find both o2 sensors- find knock sensor - find install info
-Wire/Wire connectors
-Copper Spray
-Coolant
-Oil/Oil Filter
-Colored Tape- marking- colored markers
-Zip Lock Bags
-Haynes Manual- head stud tightning order- w/ torque lbs. -
10-19-2009
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Re: Y7 to Y8 Mini Me Swap - ECU install Clarification - Parts Check List for Mini Me Wow, no one answered you in a month. I was searching for answers for a completely different thing and ran into this, which I've done before.
One person answered with a question about it being worth it; it depends how cheap you're getting the stuff for, what kind of condition the car is in, how mechanically inclined you are, what kind of tools you have at your disposal, if you get frustrated easily, and how fast you're looking to go.
You'll need a good set of metric tools; I'm not talking about a 10-18mm 3/8ths ratchet and wrench set, you need a lot of tools. I can't think of everything right now or ever will, but here's a small example list:
1. Ratchets, both 1/2 inch and 3/8ths...1/4 inch wouldn't hurt either, for torque and tight spaces. Lot's of sockets, 10-19mm at least (most Honda bolt heads are 10, 12, 14, 17, & 19mm, but there is the occasional oddity including oil pressure and knock sensor sockets which are 1 1/16 inch), but there are also larger ones too. You need torque wrenches, aluminum can strip very easily.
2. You need a big a** breaker bar and the special Honda crankshaft holder tool, so that you don't turn the crank the wrong way and ruin sh*t and you will never get the crank pulley off without them.
3. A good hydraulic jack, jack stands, and wheel chocks
4. All sorts of different pliers for hose clamps that are hard to reach (I need some hose pliers, think about that one, it makes it quicker with all those old hoses...twist hoses loose before you pull).
5. A timing light (if you're getting used parts, you want one with a tach, in case you need to adjust the idle) and possibly a multimeter to track down wiring issues and if you get a TB without a TPS (you need to calibrate that PITA sensor).
6. Feeler gauges to adjust valve lash (that's a couple of hours of work right there) on your used or rebuilt head and a spark plug gapper.
7. Soldering iron, solder, flux, wire, shrink tube and possibly some ECU harness pins (when I did my swap, I searched and searched for 'em and finally found them a year later at some random Radio Shack...evidence that they are available).
8. A real factory service manual (buy, beg, borrow, or steal), no Haynes or Chilton B.S. because they don't have all the torque specs and are often wrong or generalize about things.
That's $$$ right there. If you have the tools already, most of them or can borrow some...you needn't worry, but expect a couple of trips to the tool store.
You can see that there are going to be some time consuming affairs, remember that when you rush yourself trying to get it finished. Give yourself a few days to do this and don't be surprised to run into a couple of problems after it is "all done". If this is your daily driver, you may want to get some rides to work secured that week.
What kind of condition is the motor in? If you have 178K miles, this would probably be a waste of time and cash....you're half way through the life of the oil rings and crank bearings (assuming the engine is in perfect condition, i.e. never-ever ran low on oil and changed every 3000, over heated, etc). This would be a good time for a build from scratch, $7K crate motor, or a low mileage (kilometer) JDM B series; an H22 would probably be cheaper and is more powerful as these are not in as high demand as the K or B. Of course, you would have to get axles, ecu, mounts and trans, but these come as kits now. Take in to consideration that your car is 12 years old and your suspension bushings need replacement as well (2.5 years and 40K miles after my swap I need new ball joints and bushings all around) Start saving now..
NEEDED PARTS:
-y8 knock sensor - yes, believe it or not the Y7 has a threaded hole on the back of the block for the sensor, all D16Y blocks are the same; they are assembled with the pistons and rods for whatever the end result is (Y8, Y7, or Y5) and then stamped on the block with the code. There is also no "oil orifice" to pull as with the D15A and D15B blocks also. The Y7 is the simpler swap.
- y8 wiring harness - the secondary o2 sensor on the Y8 comes from the dash harness, Y7 is from the engine harness...don't waste the $ on this as you're going to have to modify the harness anyway (I found this out the hard way), if you're harness is working, you should run the knock sensor, vtec, etc to your Y8 ECU (that's what you need the pins from Radio Shack for...this is covered on the net). Remember there are two different OBD2 specifications, OBD2a (96-98) and OBD2b (99-00)...connectors to the ECU are different as well as other things.
-D16y8 Head /gasket - Buying a used head is a dangerous proposition, get one cheap and have it rebuilt: cost you $300-400. If you have a machine shop around and your genuine Honda manual, you can have the used head checked before you buy and install it. Gasket yes; if you get a bad head and install it, you'll need another...ditto for head bolts.
-D16y8 Intake Manifold /gasket - You need one from 96-98, without the air injection (nipple closest to the head, in between runners #2 and #3, and little holes above the intake ports mean air injection). If you have an auto you need one for an auto and manual to manual.
-D16y8 Throttle Body /gasket - same as intake manifold, auto-auto, manual-manual
-D16y8 Fuel Rail - I think the Y7 and the fuel pressure regulator are the same
-D16y8 Fuel Injectors - Y8 injectors are 240cc OBD2a and shared with the B16A3..I think (I used Y8)
-Exhaust Manifold Gasket - Why would you be taking this off unless....Y8 header, cat, and cat back...that's some cash
-Timing Belt - yes and a water pump and thermostat...you may want an adjustable cam gear too
- 96-00 civc ex spark plugs - no, one heat range colder ZFR6F-11 (stock is ZFR5F-11) for the higher compression
- dizzy ex y8 - Y7 is the same (96-98 OBD2a, 99-00 OBD2b)
-Intake - yup
-ECU P2P: 96-00 OBD-2 ex -Vtec Comp - find both o2 sensors- find knock sensor - find install info - no, no, no...o2 sensors are the same, but the ECU thing is tough. Some OBD2a (96-98) Y8 motors had a Fuel Tank Pressure sender and some didn't and the same with the Y7 motors. You need to find out whether you car has a FTP sensor or not and then get an ECU that does or doesn't look for one (my 97 4DR LX does not have an FTP sensor, but the 98 Y8 4DR ECU I got went looking for one and threw a CEL, the 97 Coupe ECU I replaced it with doesn't look for one... there is also a way around it on the net somewhere). Always, OBD2a-OBD2a, you're outta luck with the OBD2b Y8 because it has air injection.
-Wire/Wire connectors - yeah, but you're always better off soldering and heat shrinking the wires together...lasts longer and a better connection. And you need a heat gun for shrink tubing, a hair dryer will not get hot enough.
-Copper Spray - for the exhaust manifold gasket and head gasket, I presume
-Coolant - yes, you need to drain the system completely
-Oil/Oil Filter - uh-huh
-Colored Tape- marking- colored markers - yes, if you mix things up or forget stuff, a digi cam helps too (a picture is worth a thousand words).
-Zip Lock Bags - huh?
-Haynes Manual- head stud tightning order- w/ torque lbs. - New head bolts (don't use studs from ARP in case you mess up, studs are not easy to remove) Factory Honda, no Haynes. There is an order and a set of steps to torquing the bolts down.
- Y8 trans (the gearing is made for the Y8) and clutch, you don't need to, but advised
Fast?
I made 115HP on a mustang dyno, with stock exhaust, a header and an intake. When we advanced the cam 2 degrees I ended up at 119.5HP (about 145 at the crank and a nice flat torque curve). The car was significantly faster, but not fast. I have not taken it to the drag strip, but expect low 16s. I was planning to go back to the dyno with the Blox IM, 62mm TB, and an exhaust (which I never got), but other problems related to the car being old put that off until next summer.
Cheap Honda Acura OEM new parts and where you can go looking to see which ECU you need by the FTP sesnor:
Bernardiparts.com
I have a bunch of stuff if you're interested (like the throttle body and intake manifold, switched over to a Blox IM and 62mm TB...OEM TB is on car right now because the 62 was sent in for service).
One person answered with a question about it being worth it; it depends how cheap you're getting the stuff for, what kind of condition the car is in, how mechanically inclined you are, what kind of tools you have at your disposal, if you get frustrated easily, and how fast you're looking to go.
You'll need a good set of metric tools; I'm not talking about a 10-18mm 3/8ths ratchet and wrench set, you need a lot of tools. I can't think of everything right now or ever will, but here's a small example list:
1. Ratchets, both 1/2 inch and 3/8ths...1/4 inch wouldn't hurt either, for torque and tight spaces. Lot's of sockets, 10-19mm at least (most Honda bolt heads are 10, 12, 14, 17, & 19mm, but there is the occasional oddity including oil pressure and knock sensor sockets which are 1 1/16 inch), but there are also larger ones too. You need torque wrenches, aluminum can strip very easily.
2. You need a big a** breaker bar and the special Honda crankshaft holder tool, so that you don't turn the crank the wrong way and ruin sh*t and you will never get the crank pulley off without them.
3. A good hydraulic jack, jack stands, and wheel chocks
4. All sorts of different pliers for hose clamps that are hard to reach (I need some hose pliers, think about that one, it makes it quicker with all those old hoses...twist hoses loose before you pull).
5. A timing light (if you're getting used parts, you want one with a tach, in case you need to adjust the idle) and possibly a multimeter to track down wiring issues and if you get a TB without a TPS (you need to calibrate that PITA sensor).
6. Feeler gauges to adjust valve lash (that's a couple of hours of work right there) on your used or rebuilt head and a spark plug gapper.
7. Soldering iron, solder, flux, wire, shrink tube and possibly some ECU harness pins (when I did my swap, I searched and searched for 'em and finally found them a year later at some random Radio Shack...evidence that they are available).
8. A real factory service manual (buy, beg, borrow, or steal), no Haynes or Chilton B.S. because they don't have all the torque specs and are often wrong or generalize about things.
That's $$$ right there. If you have the tools already, most of them or can borrow some...you needn't worry, but expect a couple of trips to the tool store.
You can see that there are going to be some time consuming affairs, remember that when you rush yourself trying to get it finished. Give yourself a few days to do this and don't be surprised to run into a couple of problems after it is "all done". If this is your daily driver, you may want to get some rides to work secured that week.
What kind of condition is the motor in? If you have 178K miles, this would probably be a waste of time and cash....you're half way through the life of the oil rings and crank bearings (assuming the engine is in perfect condition, i.e. never-ever ran low on oil and changed every 3000, over heated, etc). This would be a good time for a build from scratch, $7K crate motor, or a low mileage (kilometer) JDM B series; an H22 would probably be cheaper and is more powerful as these are not in as high demand as the K or B. Of course, you would have to get axles, ecu, mounts and trans, but these come as kits now. Take in to consideration that your car is 12 years old and your suspension bushings need replacement as well (2.5 years and 40K miles after my swap I need new ball joints and bushings all around) Start saving now..
NEEDED PARTS:
-y8 knock sensor - yes, believe it or not the Y7 has a threaded hole on the back of the block for the sensor, all D16Y blocks are the same; they are assembled with the pistons and rods for whatever the end result is (Y8, Y7, or Y5) and then stamped on the block with the code. There is also no "oil orifice" to pull as with the D15A and D15B blocks also. The Y7 is the simpler swap.
- y8 wiring harness - the secondary o2 sensor on the Y8 comes from the dash harness, Y7 is from the engine harness...don't waste the $ on this as you're going to have to modify the harness anyway (I found this out the hard way), if you're harness is working, you should run the knock sensor, vtec, etc to your Y8 ECU (that's what you need the pins from Radio Shack for...this is covered on the net). Remember there are two different OBD2 specifications, OBD2a (96-98) and OBD2b (99-00)...connectors to the ECU are different as well as other things.
-D16y8 Head /gasket - Buying a used head is a dangerous proposition, get one cheap and have it rebuilt: cost you $300-400. If you have a machine shop around and your genuine Honda manual, you can have the used head checked before you buy and install it. Gasket yes; if you get a bad head and install it, you'll need another...ditto for head bolts.
-D16y8 Intake Manifold /gasket - You need one from 96-98, without the air injection (nipple closest to the head, in between runners #2 and #3, and little holes above the intake ports mean air injection). If you have an auto you need one for an auto and manual to manual.
-D16y8 Throttle Body /gasket - same as intake manifold, auto-auto, manual-manual
-D16y8 Fuel Rail - I think the Y7 and the fuel pressure regulator are the same
-D16y8 Fuel Injectors - Y8 injectors are 240cc OBD2a and shared with the B16A3..I think (I used Y8)
-Exhaust Manifold Gasket - Why would you be taking this off unless....Y8 header, cat, and cat back...that's some cash
-Timing Belt - yes and a water pump and thermostat...you may want an adjustable cam gear too
- 96-00 civc ex spark plugs - no, one heat range colder ZFR6F-11 (stock is ZFR5F-11) for the higher compression
- dizzy ex y8 - Y7 is the same (96-98 OBD2a, 99-00 OBD2b)
-Intake - yup
-ECU P2P: 96-00 OBD-2 ex -Vtec Comp - find both o2 sensors- find knock sensor - find install info - no, no, no...o2 sensors are the same, but the ECU thing is tough. Some OBD2a (96-98) Y8 motors had a Fuel Tank Pressure sender and some didn't and the same with the Y7 motors. You need to find out whether you car has a FTP sensor or not and then get an ECU that does or doesn't look for one (my 97 4DR LX does not have an FTP sensor, but the 98 Y8 4DR ECU I got went looking for one and threw a CEL, the 97 Coupe ECU I replaced it with doesn't look for one... there is also a way around it on the net somewhere). Always, OBD2a-OBD2a, you're outta luck with the OBD2b Y8 because it has air injection.
-Wire/Wire connectors - yeah, but you're always better off soldering and heat shrinking the wires together...lasts longer and a better connection. And you need a heat gun for shrink tubing, a hair dryer will not get hot enough.
-Copper Spray - for the exhaust manifold gasket and head gasket, I presume
-Coolant - yes, you need to drain the system completely
-Oil/Oil Filter - uh-huh
-Colored Tape- marking- colored markers - yes, if you mix things up or forget stuff, a digi cam helps too (a picture is worth a thousand words).
-Zip Lock Bags - huh?
-Haynes Manual- head stud tightning order- w/ torque lbs. - New head bolts (don't use studs from ARP in case you mess up, studs are not easy to remove) Factory Honda, no Haynes. There is an order and a set of steps to torquing the bolts down.
- Y8 trans (the gearing is made for the Y8) and clutch, you don't need to, but advised
Fast?
I made 115HP on a mustang dyno, with stock exhaust, a header and an intake. When we advanced the cam 2 degrees I ended up at 119.5HP (about 145 at the crank and a nice flat torque curve). The car was significantly faster, but not fast. I have not taken it to the drag strip, but expect low 16s. I was planning to go back to the dyno with the Blox IM, 62mm TB, and an exhaust (which I never got), but other problems related to the car being old put that off until next summer.
Cheap Honda Acura OEM new parts and where you can go looking to see which ECU you need by the FTP sesnor:
Bernardiparts.com
I have a bunch of stuff if you're interested (like the throttle body and intake manifold, switched over to a Blox IM and 62mm TB...OEM TB is on car right now because the 62 was sent in for service).
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