Political DiscussionA place to hold political debates and general discussion. Please remember to always respect the opinions of other members and above all else, be civil.
It's not like they don't have a chance... tons of immigrants come to this country legally every day. It's a long, slow process. I know this because I've watched the Girlfriend and her family go through it.... six years they've been here and they just got greencards like 2 weeks ago.
i know how that goes. my family moved here cause of my dad's job so we got a temp work visa to stay. then it turned out that my dad was stayin longer than the original 5 years that was planned out, so thats when we applied for our green cards. basically, moved here in 91, didnt get our green cards til 99. who knows when i'll get my citizenship but hey, im going thru the process.
i hope your ****ing kidding. why join the boycott. borders in other countrys are enforced much more then they are here. other countrys would never let this happen. there are boarders for a reason. i dont understand the point in letting illegal immigrants stay in this country. its lilke if you can cross the boarder you get a prize. bull shit. thats stupid. they need to be brought back to mexico. I do think they need to bring out the fire hoses and the dogs like they would in the 50's and 60's.
so u and every1 who says "send them back" should go back to the country their ancestors came from right? didnt think so. so it was ok for ur ancestors but not for these ppl? come on this country was founded by immigrants for immigrants, ppl searchin for a better life. do u think that ur ancestors had it easy when they first came here, hell no. they had to work hard to give their children a better food, education,a better life overall. thats what hispanic ppl r tryin to do, thats y they take care of other ppl's kid,clean houses and mow other ppls lawns, so their kids wont have to
so u and every1 who says "send them back" should go back to the country their ancestors came from right? didnt think so. so it was ok for ur ancestors but not for these ppl? come on this country was founded by immigrants for immigrants, ppl searchin for a better life. do u think that ur ancestors had it easy when they first came here, hell no. they had to work hard to give their children a better food, education,a better life overall. thats what hispanic ppl r tryin to do, thats y they take care of other ppl's kid,clean houses and mow other ppls lawns, so their kids wont have to
Both my parents were born in the US(I'm of Irish and Polish descent), My Grandfather on my Father's side LEGALLY immigrated to the US through Ellis Island. My Grandmother was born in the US but her parents LEGALLY immigrated to the US. On my Mother's side my Grandmother LEGALLY immigrated from Poland to the US.
See a trend? Legal immigration is fine. Go through the process, prove that you really want to be here.
Friend of mine had an idea, Have an "Immigration Fast Trak" You can get in the country but you have to spend 1 year in the military in Iraq. You get the same training as regular recruits but when you get out you get a green card. Not full citizenship but it's a start. It solves two problems at once.
When my family came here they did not come as a wave of uneducated people. They did not come from a country that told them how to get here. I am not saying the Latinos are stupid they are just raw. When my family came here they did not send the money they earned back to Ireland, France or England. They built a life here with no desire to turn America in to Europe. The problem is that the world has changed since the last one of my ancestors came over. My last ancestor moved before there was a such thing as a social security number. There were no cars or drivers license. There was nothing like there is today.
Today's illegals all need social security numbers to work in this country. Lets say half of them work at a place where they would need a ssn. That is 6 million people using a someone else's ssn. Screwing the legal owner over when they try to get the assistance they earned. Making them legal because they have been here a long time will simply leave the original legal resident in a situation where they must clean up the mess. If amnesty for everyone who has been here for 5 years takes effect that would mean that guys that came here with the 9/11 terrorists would be made U.S. residents(bush like argument I can not believe I am using it.). This would also force a massive boom of building hospitals, schools, firehouses, and hiring fireman or police. This sounds great. However the tax base has not increased by much. We would need to provide the services for 12 million illegals that make the same as 5 million legals(no one is going to pay more for a lawn service because your suddenly legal). I say keep it the way it is. Don't change a thing. Just enforce the borders. Everything is humming along. Just check construction, meat packing, yard crews and typical illegal alien jobs from time to time to make sure everyone is paying pay roll taxes. Don't attack the workers attack the companies that don't pay the correct pay roll.
Why can Russians flood in legally yet Mexicans cant? Don't tell me it is that hard. Russians come here with 4 kids and most of them have a wife that doesn't work. About 1 family a year moves from the former USSR to my block. They all do it legally. They get sponsors from their church and they get it done. I am Catholic why hasn't any Mexican written my church asking for a sponsor. If Latinos really wanted to do it right why hasnt my family been asked to sponsor anyone. We have sent a lot of money to Chiapas(sp?) through the church but no one has asked for a sponsor. They just want to do it the easy way. Then when they have been here 3 years and realize the easy way is now the hard way they start crying. I would sponsor a Mexican. It isn't about racism its about people being to lazy to do the right thing.
Last edited by nick95673 : 05-01-2006 at 12:29 PM.
ur grandparents did it legally. cool but the ppl who did it legally r only about 1-10% of ALL immigrants.
the military already has something that ur friend thought of, but all u have to do is sign up.if they go to war then they go to war. it would be pretty fv(ked up if they would die for this country w/out being a citizens.
Friend of mine had an idea, Have an "Immigration Fast Trak" You can get in the country but you have to spend 1 year in the military in Iraq. You get the same training as regular recruits but when you get out you get a green card. Not full citizenship but it's a start. It solves two problems at once.
You won't have two problems right now if you guys didn't invade Iraq illegally, ie not sponsored by the U.N. However thats another thread...
Now to think of it, you guys are upset about "illegals" coming into your country, but you have absolutely no problems invading other countries "illegally, citing "The war on terrorism", and "Weapons of mass destruction" and other false pretenses. lol, thats pretty funny. What goes around comes around.
Lets face it, you guys don't have money nor the resources to create a "Fast Track" immigration program right now. Start handing out those citizenships so that they can start to contribute to the state legally. Way hold down the ones that are doing something good for your country?
Reward the good ones right now with citizenship, deport the ones that commit crimes right away.
When my family came here they did not come as a wave of uneducated people. They did not come from a country that told them how to get here. I am not saying the Latinos are stupid they are just raw. When my family came here they did not send the money they earned back to Ireland, France or England. They built a life here with no desire to turn America in to Europe. The problem is that the world has changed since the last one of my ancestors came over. My last ancestor moved before there was a such thing as a social security number. There were no cars or drivers license. There was nothing like there is today.
Today's illegals all need social security numbers to work in this country. Lets say half of them work at a place where they would need a ssn. That is 6 million people using a someone else's ssn. Screwing the legal owner over when they try to get the assistance they earned. Making them legal because they have been here a long time will simply leave the original legal resident in a situation where they must clean up the mess. If amnesty for everyone who has been here for 5 years takes effect that would mean that guys that came here with the 9/11 terrorists would be made U.S. residents(bush like argument I can not believe I am using it.). This would also force a massive boom of building hospitals, schools, firehouses, and hiring fireman or police. This sounds great. However the tax base has not increased by much. We would need to provide the services for 12 million illegals that make the same as 5 million legals(no one is going to pay more for a lawn service because your suddenly legal). I say keep it the way it is. Don't change a thing. Just enforce the borders. Everything is humming along. Just check construction, meat packing, yard crews and typical illegal alien jobs from time to time to make sure everyone is paying pay roll taxes. Don't attack the workers attack the companies that don't pay the correct pay roll.
Why can Russians flood in legally yet Mexicans cant? Don't tell me it is that hard. Russians come here with 4 kids and most of them have a wife that doesn't work. About 1 family a year moves from the former USSR to my block. They all do it legally. They get sponsors from their church and they get it done. I am Catholic why hasn't any Mexican written my church asking for a sponsor. If Latinos really wanted to do it right why hasnt my family been asked to sponsor anyone. We have sent a lot of money to Chiapas(sp?) through the church but no one has asked for a sponsor. They just want to do it the easy way. Then when they have been here 3 years and realize the easy way is now the hard way they start crying. I would sponsor a Mexican. It isn't about racism its about people being to lazy to do the right thing.
i understand what ur saying its not hard,my mom came ilegally, but has been a citizens for 8years now. shes helping other ppl who r here and ppl who want to come over legally. i just dont understand how ppl can say throw all ilegals (sp?) out?
it isnt hard to get citizenship legally.it just the fact that U.S. and Mexico share a border most Mexicans say "screw waiting 3,4,or 5years i can give my family a better life now" as with Russia they cant hop a border or swim across
i understand what ur saying its not hard,my mom came ilegally, but has been a citizens for 8years now. shes helping other ppl who r here and ppl who want to come over legally. i just dont understand how ppl can say throw all ilegals (sp?) out?
it isnt hard to get citizenship legally.it just the fact that U.S. and Mexico share a border most Mexicans say "screw waiting 3,4,or 5years i can give my family a better life now" as with Russia they cant hop a border or swim across
So you agree that stronger border enforcement is needed. If we could make it more difficult to get here it would force people to take the legal route. If we catch you crossing the border we put you on a ship to Chiapas so you can walk all the way back.
You won't have two problems right now if you guys didn't invade Iraq illegally, ie not sponsored by the U.N. However thats another thread...
Now to think of it, you guys are upset about "illegals" coming into your country, but you have absolutely no problems invading other countries "illegally, citing "The war on terrorism", and "Weapons of mass destruction" and other false pretenses. lol, thats pretty funny. What goes around comes around.
Lets face it, you guys don't have money nor the resources to create a "Fast Track" immigration program right now. Start handing out those citizenships so that they can start to contribute to the state legally. Way hold down the ones that are doing something good for your country?
Reward the good ones right now with citizenship, deport the ones that commit crimes right away.
No response to mine? o well... anyway
Define good citizen bad citizen? They are breaking the law, if they contribute so GREATLY to this country and they are "good" then they will apply for citizenship, the ones that don't porbably do it to avoid the hassle.
Also how are we to know which ones commit crimes? They don't have any way that WE can track them unless they ARE going thru the process to become a citizen.
Also we did not invade Iraq to work there, we did it to rid ourselves and others of "bad things" I say to sum up the arguements about what is over there. There is NO put together government to consider us illegal anyway, it fell apart. illegal = against the law, what law in Iraq is there to say we can't come in their borders? There is NONE, because the goverment no longer exists, and WHEN it did they had no requirements on citizen ship.
Who gives a flying rats ass about the UN (however like you said, thats another topic)
So you agree that stronger border enforcement is needed. If we could make it more difficult to get here it would force people to take the legal route. If we catch you crossing the border we put you on a ship to Chiapas so you can walk all the way back.
yes i agree. just not with the ppl that say kick all ilegal immigrants out.
cause a lot of ilegals contribute this country not just sit and complain about gettin sh!t for free
this is for those that say throw them back into mexico.....i say maybe we should throw all u back to were u came....if i remember it indians were here first and all of u back in ur family tree a great great grand dad came here.so should we throw ur as$ back to were u came .i am jamaican here legaly but i am from indian anceste so to all get off my fuc king land u as$holes.i just say let them be herebut give them a time frame to be legalized after time is up out u go.
Today's illegals all need social security numbers to work in this country. Lets say half of them work at a place where they would need a ssn. That is 6 million people using a someone else's ssn. Screwing the legal owner over when they try to get the assistance they earned. Making them legal because they have been here a long time will simply leave the original legal resident in a situation where they must clean up the mess.
as far as i know (and im not flaming neither just adding my .02 cents) if the person uses someone elses ssn that person (the legal one) actually is in favor, cuz it earns that money that the illegal immigrant is putting in their taxes, they are going to get more in retirement. Now i know of some people here at work (there 2 companies) use someone else's ssn but is SOOOOOOOO easy to detect it, just call your local SS company and verify the number and name and they will tell u in 5 secs if it is real or not, sometimes the person already passed away and obviously cant be working
(no one is going to pay more for a lawn service because your suddenly legal). I say keep it the way it is. Don't change a thing. Just enforce the borders. Everything is humming along. Just check construction, meat packing, yard crews and typical illegal alien jobs from time to time to make sure everyone is paying pay roll taxes. Don't attack the workers attack the companies that don't pay the correct pay roll.
no one will pay more for a lawn service but that person is able to look for a better paying job now that he/she is legal. It gives you a better opportunity to better yourself with another job or an education. I am a payroll clerk in my company and i do see that the immigrants from the other companpy (yes i have to do their payroll too) pay their taxes, local and state, plus the OPT/EMS Taxes
Why can Russians flood in legally yet Mexicans cant? Don't tell me it is that hard. Russians come here with 4 kids and most of them have a wife that doesn't work. About 1 family a year moves from the former USSR to my block. They all do it legally. They get sponsors from their church and they get it done. I am Catholic why hasn't any Mexican written my church asking for a sponsor. If Latinos really wanted to do it right why hasnt my family been asked to sponsor anyone. We have sent a lot of money to Chiapas(sp?) through the church but no one has asked for a sponsor. They just want to do it the easy way. Then when they have been here 3 years and realize the easy way is now the hard way they start crying. I would sponsor a Mexican. It isn't about racism its about people being to lazy to do the right thing.
sponsoring someone is hard, you gotta PROVE that the job you are offering someone has been posted in the newspaper and no one qualified for it other than the illegal person, you have to make x amount of money, and provide your bank statements and all that. it is kinda hard.
This debate sucks, no one will ever be happy, and there is no reasonable compromise. A guest worker program won't work because it is simply exploitation ie. slavery. We give them the opportunity to work here but give them no rights as citizens, which will create a second class person in America worse then what blacks and legal hispanics claim to be. The only option is to make them all legal, OR kick them all out, but our congressmen just can't come up with a compromise and I don't think they will for a long time.
The argument about us all being illegal immigrants because of our ancestors is not valid. Everyone in the Americas in all of history have been immigrants. I don't remember reading about any group of people that originated in the Americas. At the time of colonization we weren't American, we were British, so you'll have to throw that agrument to them, and they won't hear it because they don't give a sh!t.
The US was a much better country when it took a neutral stance in the world. Now the US government thinks it's the world's police and there to stop all evil, when there is no such thing as evil, it's just what you think is evil according to your views and opinions. This country isn't the land of the free anymore, and it has definitely strayed away from it's founding ideals. It's hard to even live here when you have to live with the hypocrisy that is the United States government and it's people. I can't help but see our founding fathers looking down at us in shame.
