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this is what makes me mad
1. you want to work here, but you don't want to learn the language.
2. you wanna live here but you don't want to do it legally.
it took 3 years for MY citizenship to go through. and ALOT of fvckin time and money. ALOT. its not fair.
i keep my culture. but i show respect to this country by interacting with people in it.
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^^^ word..... for once silverdevil and I see on common ground... lol... I was in europe for a while and it was really irritiating how most of the people I was with were acting....
^^^ word..... for once silverdevil and I see on common ground... lol... I was in europe for a while and it was really irritiating how most of the people I was with were acting....
LOL...
Most people who've traveled overseas know exactly what I'm talking about. If you've only been there with your family you might not have noticed but if you go with a bunch of friends or coworkers you would have to be really self-involved not to notice.
__________________ I have too much respect for the idea of God to make it responsible for such an absurd world.
-Georges Duhamel
The radical of one century is the conservative of the next. The radical invents the views. When he has worn them out the conservative adopts them.
-Mark Twain
And, yes, I'm saying that Americans do not respect the countries they go to. I've been to 7 countries on official military orders and have traveled to each location with other fellow soldiers and government-contracted civilians. I do not recall one of those trips where most of the people I traveled with or that I worked with once there (I'm talking of only the Americans now) had no respect for the local custums and thought that, just because they were American, they deserved better treatment than and from the locals.
Ask anyone living near a military installation in Germany, Spain, France, Saudi Arabia, Britain, Italy, or Turkey (those are the places I've visited) what they think of the military presence and you will get the same response: "we like that it helps our economy but we have too many problems with the Americans not respecting our customs." One good example of this was when I was in Saudi Arabia. Women REFUSED to wear an abaya (traditional women head gear) and DEMANDED to be allowed to drive. Well, in Saudi Arabia, it is LAW that women are forbiden from driving and customary to wear the abaya. Those are local laws and customs that Americans do not want to respect. Another is that women are not allowed to touch men (or the other way around) but our guys never made an effort to not touch women in public places (for example, one guy tapped a woman on the shoulder in the marketplace). Also, when I was in Spain, it is customary to close down a store from 12pm - 4pm yet Americans got mad if they were kicked out of the mall because it was closing down and, in some cases, demanded to be allowed to remain.
Sorry but, that's just the U.S. military mentality...
__________________ Normal is getting dressed in clothes that you buy for work and driving through traffic in a car that you are still paying for in order to get to the job you need to pay for the clothes and the car, and the house you leave vacant all day so you can afford to live in it. - Fightclub
...there is no justice without sin... Member of a dying breed: The white man in Northern Virginia. "RadioShack: You've got questions, We've ripped you off" Support local music... Sleep with a musician.
Well, I guess I just take the widest definition of the word FREE because, to me, it means that people have the right to do as they please. If that means speak Spanish, Tagalog, Korean, Italian, or piglatin, then that's what it means. Just because someone moves here doesn't mean that they have to speak the language. It's to their disadvantage to not do so, but it's a personal choice they are free to make. Also, if they do learn English, they have the right to not speak it in public if they do not wish to.
Why does it bother you so much that products have Spanish on them? That is there for one reason and one reason only: to sell more of those products. Companies are not forced to print their labels in any language. They do so because they know that it helps them sell more of their crap and that is worth the cost of printing more words on a label. You should'nt be mad just because a label has a language on it that you don't like.
Have you ever been to Japan? Many of their signs are in Japanese and English (or attempted English). That doesn't bother the Japanese people at all. You know why? Because they are not insecure. It doesn't affect them to have signs on the street and government forms in the office written in two languages and it shouldn't bother anyone else who believes in freedom. This is not Communist Russia where the state dictates what you can and cannot do. Here in America people are free to speak the language they please and, as a business, free to try to sell to more people.
So, what's wrong with walking down the street with a Philipino flag? Don't tell me you haven't seen Pinoys walking down the street with flags on their shirts or flags on their cars. They're Asians. The reason you don't see other Asians do it is because, while they are patriotic, they are not as fanatic about where they came from as most Hispanics (including Philipinos because they were under Spanish control for almost 400 years). Americans are that way too, tho.
Americans have the bad habit of thinking they are better than anyone else. They go around thinking they deserve everything just because they're Americans. Have you ever traveled abroad? It's EASY to spot Americans because of the way they dress and their attitudes towards the locals and their customs. Americans go to other countries and expect those people to speak English; imagine the arrogance that implies! Americans have no respect for people in their own country so I don't know why I would expect them to respect people here in the U.S. That's all it boils down to, too, is just respect for other human beings around you.
products: yeah, they are putting more than one language to sell more products because illegals can read f'in english...that's my problem with it. i hate that we have to cater to them...that's just not right!
that whole asian thing...they are not a land of immigrants! enough said.
yeah, i have traveled abroad and i expect nothing when it comes to language. you are generalizing too much on that one.
flags: if the mexicans are fanatics about their home country then go back to it if you don't want to be here legally. look, if i were to come into your home i would abide by your customs...i would not strut in and plop down on the couch, take off my shoes and put them on your coffee table. would you?
we are not asking them to not speak their language of choice, that's fine, like i said, do it in your home but when it comes to business...that is a different story. it annoys me that i HAVE TO take a foregin language, spanish, because there are so many of them here. look, you take a foreign language to do business and communicate and mostly on a macro scale but when you take spanish, you do it on a micro scale which is totally ridiculous since we do not do major business with them!
we should not have a spanish curriculm in any school for any reason! if you want an education in america then speak and read english...everyone else does. you talk about respect but you are not respecting the ways of america!! hell we already give illegals a free education as is, which i think is stupid, why should we integrate a curriculum for them? besides all of that, do you know how much more of an expense it would be to have individual teachers for each language....ummmm, i vote NO on that one!! you see, there are many things that are either directly or indirectly increasing prices for many things in this country. i do not want to pay extra taxes just so an illegal can get an education when my kid is getting underpaid teachers as is. you are saying to have people grow up getting an education in their langauge and not learn ours...that is just going to lead to segregation, simple as that.
there are many arguments about going to other countries and their customs...well that is NOT america and america is unique! as for those FEW who insult the natives of their visiting location...i can't say much for them except for that they are only a few while illegals are 11 million and some change. basically, you cannot compare us to any other country because no other country is like us.
__________________ If XTC didn't fvck up your brain so much I would roll everyday and have a part-time job for the rest of my life.
even more reason to refuse amnesty....... its kinda like:
"hey Saddam! We are going to come invade your country in 3 weeks and we will be looking for WMD's and then were gonna try to take you out. Remember 3 WEEKS, get ready!!!"
i say "screw you" to the lawmakers in this country for being so stupid and shortsighted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
can we say horse sh1t?
if they rush the border...there won't be any of them left in Mexico! Should we expect to change from America to Americo?
and that's b.s. if the illegals are granted amnesty...stick to the original plan of making them felons!
time for a BIG electric fence and a moat with sharks. with all the $$ we have lost already to illegals we could have built 1000 walls and hired 1000's of border agents.
__________________
Official F1 fan club member #6
Last edited by sevenplaces; 04-13-2006 at 05:20 PM.
Reason: Automerged Doublepost
does anyone know the law about "shoot on sight" when it comes to illegals juming the border? maybe, instead of giving guns to our allies overseas we could give them to people on the border and they could peck off people as they come across? okay, so i am being somewhat sarcastic about that...in no way do i condone the shooting of innocent people.
__________________ If XTC didn't fvck up your brain so much I would roll everyday and have a part-time job for the rest of my life.
__________________ Normal is getting dressed in clothes that you buy for work and driving through traffic in a car that you are still paying for in order to get to the job you need to pay for the clothes and the car, and the house you leave vacant all day so you can afford to live in it. - Fightclub
...there is no justice without sin... Member of a dying breed: The white man in Northern Virginia. "RadioShack: You've got questions, We've ripped you off" Support local music... Sleep with a musician.
This is probably the last post I'm going to make here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
products: yeah, they are putting more than one language to sell more products because illegals can read f'in english...that's my problem with it. i hate that we have to cater to them...that's just not right!
You forget that many LEGAL aliens prefer to speak Spanish and are more comfortable reading in that language than English. If companies want to print labels in Japanese to get the Jap population to purchase their products then that's their prerogative. I see nothing wrong with that. They don't just put it for the illegals.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
flags: if the mexicans are fanatics about their home country then go back to it if you don't want to be here legally. look, if i were to come into your home i would abide by your customs...i would not strut in and plop down on the couch, take off my shoes and put them on your coffee table. would you?
This isn't a 'home' where you get to control what goes on. This is a democracy where the rule is set by the people who pay taxes. If those people request something then it's the duty of their elected representatives to look into it. Everyone thinks that the schools in Cali are catering to the illegals, when, in fact, they are catering to the legal immigrants who want their children to grow up speaking both languages as it's an advantage to them to do so. People that come to this country are free to keep their customs and traditions. Nobody says they have to blend in. That's why we are a country of freedom. I mention how Americans don't respect other countries as a sign of hypocrisy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
we are not asking them to not speak their language of choice, that's fine, like i said, do it in your home but when it comes to business...that is a different story. it annoys me that i HAVE TO take a foregin language, spanish, because there are so many of them here. look, you take a foreign language to do business and communicate and mostly on a macro scale but when you take spanish, you do it on a micro scale which is totally ridiculous since we do not do major business with them!
we should not have a spanish curriculm in any school for any reason! if you want an education in america then speak and read english...everyone else does. you talk about respect but you are not respecting the ways of america!! hell we already give illegals a free education as is, which i think is stupid, why should we integrate a curriculum for them? besides all of that, do you know how much more of an expense it would be to have individual teachers for each language....ummmm, i vote NO on that one!! you see, there are many things that are either directly or indirectly increasing prices for many things in this country. i do not want to pay extra taxes just so an illegal can get an education when my kid is getting underpaid teachers as is. you are saying to have people grow up getting an education in their langauge and not learn ours...that is just going to lead to segregation, simple as that.
there are many arguments about going to other countries and their customs...well that is NOT america and america is unique! as for those FEW who insult the natives of their visiting location...i can't say much for them except for that they are only a few while illegals are 11 million and some change. basically, you cannot compare us to any other country because no other country is like us.
Let me use France and Germany as an example. For years they have marginalized the Muslim immigrants, both legal and illegal, and have created a second-class citizen society that is now backlashing against the government. It is believed that, in 50-years time, Muslims will hold a majority in both these countries and will control them politically by means of elected representatives. The same will happen here if you don't start treating immigrants with respect. They will backlash against mainstream America and it will end up being a huge problem because when 49% of the population is WASP and 51% is something else, and they get to control Congress with their elected officials, you're going to really wish you had treated them better when you had the opportunity.
__________________ I have too much respect for the idea of God to make it responsible for such an absurd world.
-Georges Duhamel
The radical of one century is the conservative of the next. The radical invents the views. When he has worn them out the conservative adopts them.
-Mark Twain
i am not forgetting anything and i don't care whether or not they prefer to speak their language or not...this is america and our native language is ENGLISH, speak it and read it or get the F out!! granted, this is only for public purposes, i don't care what you do in your own home.
we are more of a republic than we are a democracy. and yeah, the rules are supposed to be set by those who pay taxes, ALTHOUGH, all of the illegals may have some say in that and they DO NOT pay taxes, at all and for some odd reason, they seem to have a say in all of this! uhhh, WTF is that about? we should not even have to teach spanish in schools, english is the only language, simple is that, it is the native language (repeated). like i have said before, keep your traditions and customs, in your own home, don't impose them on the rest of us...i don't want it to be to an advantage for me to have to know spanish just to get a better job, i should not need to know their language.
like i have said before about the americans who disrespect other countries...they are few while mexican illegal immigrants are many!
i totally agree with on treating immigrants with respect but on the note of ILLEGAL immigrants, that is a different story. i offer no helping hand to them and leave them to fend for themselves. if you want help, schooling, medical aid...become naturalized!!! and no, i am not going to be wishing i had treated illegals better b/c illegals cannot hold office.
__________________ If XTC didn't fvck up your brain so much I would roll everyday and have a part-time job for the rest of my life.
i am not forgetting anything and i don't care whether or not they prefer to speak their language or not...this is america and our native language is ENGLISH, speak it and read it or get the F out!! granted, this is only for public purposes, i don't care what you do in your own home.
You are right, this is America; you are wrong, English is not the "native" language. There are many "native" languages so long as you count the Indians as natives. The invaders never bothered to learn the languages spoken by the Indians (sans a few translators) so why should the Americans learn Spanish? After all, it's just history repeating itself (except for Hispanics taking over without killing every single American they see). The Hispanics are taking over this country just like the British/Spanish/French and later Americans did to the Indians. Get used to it, Bubba, because, before you know it, you better know Spanish or not be able to fend for yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
we are more of a republic than we are a democracy. and yeah, the rules are supposed to be set by those who pay taxes, ALTHOUGH, all of the illegals may have some say in that and they DO NOT pay taxes, at all and for some odd reason, they seem to have a say in all of this! uhhh, WTF is that about? we should not even have to teach spanish in schools, english is the only language, simple is that, it is the native language (repeated). like i have said before, keep your traditions and customs, in your own home, don't impose them on the rest of us...i don't want it to be to an advantage for me to have to know spanish just to get a better job, i should not need to know their language.
Did you keep Indian traditions and customs? I don't think so. Illegals don't have a say but their family members, those that have been naturalized or have been born here, do have a say. Juan Jr. speaks up for Juan Sr. and Grandad Juan. With Juan Jr. having 8 kids, elected officials know that if they don't listen to Juan Jr. they are losing 9 votes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
like i have said before about the americans who disrespect other countries...they are few while mexican illegal immigrants are many!
There are more Americans that disrespect other countries than the 11 Million illegal immigrants in this country. There are over 250 Million living in the U.S. and there is no way only 5% of them disrespect other countries. It's more like 80%.
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.O.S.B.A.S.04
i totally agree with on treating immigrants with respect but on the note of ILLEGAL immigrants, that is a different story. i offer no helping hand to them and leave them to fend for themselves. if you want help, schooling, medical aid...become naturalized!!! and no, i am not going to be wishing i had treated illegals better b/c illegals cannot hold office.
Illegals cannot hold office, but they can once they become naturalized. They cannot be President, but they can be Representatives or Senators in Congress. Read the Constitution and you will see.
__________________ I have too much respect for the idea of God to make it responsible for such an absurd world.
-Georges Duhamel
The radical of one century is the conservative of the next. The radical invents the views. When he has worn them out the conservative adopts them.
-Mark Twain
okay, so the word 'native' was taken out of context but, since we were established as a country, that being america, the english language has been THE language of the country. so why should the spanish learn our language? well, for one reason, it is a different time period than what you are referring to as well as a different country! as for them taking over, i bet they will, not in my life time but they will eventually, actually i am sure they will take over.
no, i did not keep indian traditions but the white people came in with force, the mexicans are not. they do not have militia, they have unorganized gangs and that is about it and they are not fighting for the freedom of their people, they are only concerned with crime! and yes, the children of illegals do have a say and that in and of itself is unfortunate. that means one man and one woman can come over here, breed (not mate and have offspring but breed) evermore increasing our taxes to pay for their births and raising them as well as education. as for disrespecting other countries, that is a gross speculation as well as a horrible assumption that 80% of americans are rude...that is just not right. find me a figure of that and then we will talk more about that, and i am talking about a study done with more than 300 people in a longitudinal study. i guarntee you it has not been done. i am familiar with the constitution, i know what illegals can and cannot hold as well as natuaralized immigrants and what they can hold. what i said is this, if you want to have a say, become naturalized, if you don't then quit bickering because you have no say in what goes on in this country. the offices they can hold will barely make a difference in the major scheme of things. now, yes i know that their children can but they are not illegal immigrants.
p.s. thanks for the debate!
__________________ If XTC didn't fvck up your brain so much I would roll everyday and have a part-time job for the rest of my life.
