TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

What up yall. I've been working on my stage 2 build and though I'd make a DIY on how to take the retainers/valve springs/valves out. I looked around the forum for a diy, but nothing's out there- nothing that went any where near as in depth as you'd want when working on internals in your head. So here it is, the D17 specific, textless and picture-less all video DIY made all by me for you guys.

Rate it, and let me know what you think!

Any further questions, just post up and hollar at me and I'll help ya out.

Youtube link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV8ZcDVIVFM

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV8ZcDVIVFM[/YOUTUBE]

Copywrite by me, Triz, on civicforums.com, 7/25/2007

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

nice DIY BUT! theres a smaller tool by snap on that i have ALOT EASIER to use. Magnetic retainer holder and the spring comes out somewhat easy.....Just use a hammer and the snap on tool for valve install and remover ill TAKE PICS ASAP so people wanting to do this can either buy it or see the options. nice diy but snap on tool easier to use IMO but whatever gets the job done

gsniper666

iTrader: (1)

great job man.... u cleared up some questions for me... props to ya man... keep it up

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

when i rebuild my d17 next month ill make a video i got a ball hone and the valve remover i was tlaking about im eager to make it now

speedfoos

iTrader: (17)

Nice job Triz!

"This guy" says you've just raised the bar on DIYs!

TransformedBG

iTrader: (6)

Thats a great DIY! Now you can see it.. maybe ill do that on my engine build

susuking

iTrader: (2)

wow!~ best diy ever.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

LOL, you guys are gunna make me blush!

boxcarracer - I guess I forgot to add in the footage of me popping three of these off in under a minute. *snap* It didnt look that complicated did it? Straight up, this was a real simple tool to use. Only way I could see the snap on tool being any better is if it did it for you- but its built in magnet is a nice touch- only problem is finding a place that will rent to to you. I got off using this one for free, cant beat that!!

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

lol true i got my snap on tool for free but we all cant get it for free bump for the few people attempting their own rebuilds

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

^ rent it, 6 bucks a day from shucks! I returned the tool three hours later, I took a shower and a nap inbetween as well!

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

if u need any info on rebuilding like tq specs and patterns ask me i printed them all out at school so i got the entire rebuild process ill probly scan it sometime saturday

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

If its same as the civic manual (hacked online version) then I got it! Which manual are you talking about? Nevermind, dont answer that... I'm messaging u on AIM, lol.

MURDOCK

Nice Triz.

Are you going to put the same valves back or get new ones?
I ask this because I always thought if you reuse the same valves they need to go back into the same guide they were removed from, but I can't recall if you mention this or that you noted were they were removed from or maybe I'm thinking pushrods IDK.

BTW have you decided how you are going to do the valve cover?

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

^^ Hmm, ****.

Valve cover is still in progress as well, trying to find the right materials.

_unclejuice

iTrader: (8)

murdock covered what i was going to say. nice diy. but the valves need to go back in the same hole they were in. when valves and valve seat are new, theyre all perfectly round. after theyve been in the engine for a while, they distort, but the valve and seat still match unless it is in bad shape. if you reuse old valves, they need to go back in the same seat and you need to rotate them in the guide if theres any gap between the valve and the seat to make sure they seat properly. if the valves arent seating properly, which theyre probably not going to if theyre not in the same seat, you run a big risk of compression loss, and worse, chipping the edge of a valve. not to mention bad gas mileage and wicked blowby.

Maple50175

iTrader: (1)

excellent every DIY should have a video IMO

skipbarber

iTrader: (34)

i like the background music.

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

Your right your suppost to either change the valve or use a tube of some **** like sand paste lol forgot the name and grind the valve on the seat for about 15 min straight left and right , Then it will reseat the valve we did it on a single cam neon engine. But the exhaust and intake have to be the same just not same order aslong as you use the sand paste thing (ill get the name of it tommorow) to reseat

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Horrible news, I didnt keep track of what valve from what section. So what.. just need new valve seals and not a whole set of new valves as well?

_unclejuice

iTrader: (8)

dont use a paste and try to regrind valve seats by hand. very bad juju. have a machine shop do it. it might not be in bad shape. but heres the trick. always etch the valve face with a number straight up and down so you know which guide and seat it went in and which way it was oriented. and were not talkin about valve seals. you probably shouldve had those replaced too while you had it apart along with the guides. this is why head work can get a bit tricky, along with any internal work if you havent done it before. if you are really going to build this motor, i would take it to a reputable machine shop that is very good with honda heads. have them put in new seats, guides, liners, seals, valves, and maybe work in a bit of a 3 angle or 5 angle valve job, and a p&p. if youre going n/a youre going to need all the help you can get moving air through the head and those things will help. the head work without the valve job and p&p should run around 300 bucks. the p&p and valve job will vary depending on the method the shop uses. cnc p&p jobs are about the only way to go if you want accuracy. they hand do one port and a cnc machine copies it to the rest. valves arent that expensive if you stick with a stock valve. ive seen nitride valves for the d17 but theyre way overpriced. i would find stainless if you can, just in case you ever want to spray nitrous or anything, but stock valves are fine.

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

yyou can use the paste and grind method dealers use it so why not? the only thing u should change are all the seals thats a must. andlike that guy said take it to a shop but i recommend getting the arp studs i belive and working on the head ugh i gotta pull out my engines workbook to see what measurments and procedures i did on that neon engine. ill get back to u ASAP

_unclejuice

iTrader: (8)

not being an *** but this isnt a neon engine. all engines are different. i rebuild atleast 2 engines a week. if you dont know what youre doing, take it to a shop. dont think you can get a book and know it all. you shouldnt just change the seal unless you want to half *** it and then be posting in a few months because your engine is ****ed. arp studs wont be of any use to him if hes staying n/a. and again, dont try to regrind old valves by hand. get new valves and take the head with the new valves to a machine shop. tell them you want them to install the new valves with new seat, guides, and seals. they will do the rest and mill the surface flat. if you half *** this, youll be doing it all over again shortly and it always costs more the 2nd time after something has ****ed up. trust me.

ryox82

iTrader: (4)

ahhhh damn you had all that **** in baggies and lables but not the valves....I remember when I was like 16 my mothers boyfriend and I did a rebuild on his jaguar v8 and we used a box for all the rods/studs/valves/whatever the **** was in that thing lol. We numbered everything and it made it basically like putting a puzzle back together with the picture to look at. Now 9 years later and I don't even feel comfortable taking that **** out of my car. Then again, mine is a daily driver.

sql_civic

iTrader: (10)

"paste and grind method"???

Ha!

It's called valve lapping, boys. And it's an effective way of fine tuning the seal between your valve and seats. I've used this method on engines long before UncleJuice started his weekly engine building blitzes and I've found it to be effective on Honda heads that were in decent condition. You can test how well your valves seal simply by pouring some liquid in the combustion chamber with the valves installed after you've lapped them.

Head building tip #453.

When reinstalling your valves do it in a small room and put a old bed sheet on the floor so when your keepers go flying across the room you can find it in a few seconds.

Thanks Triz for the DIY. Good luck with the reassembly.

boxcarracer

iTrader: (13)

+1 for u VALVE LAPPING!!!!!! my teacher told me its a good thing to do i was wondering why he said its not recommended Owell thank u for reminding the proper name instead of paste grind.

ragingSPAM

iTrader: (8)

great vid triz...perfect for an amature diy

sql_civic

iTrader: (10)

I wouldn't say it's not recommended but possible not necessary if a machine shop precision cuts the seats and you are installing new valves. Otherwise if you are doing your own rebuild on a head that's in good condition, it really helps in reforming a good seal.

TRIZ

iTrader: (14)

Allright, so I never heard of any of this paste and grind method, or lapping as its been called.

SO I still have the head apart, been busy, aka lazy, and havent got around to this.

Head is still apart. I got my gasket pack and valve seals today. Need to consult the bible for the trick to getting them out- a set of pliers seems very wrong. So I get the valve seals out (the things with the spring around it) and this is where I have a question. Do I need to get valve guides as well, and anything else? How much do these guys run.

Also I am thinking about pushing the install date back as well and picking up new valves as well. Comments on .5mm and 1mm oversized valves? Comments on the stainless/ vs coated

I'm looking for aprox. prices on what it will cost in parts for whatever else I need aside from the valve seals I already have, and the valves I will be getting. What else will be needed like valve angleing or anything that I shouldnt be able to do myself? Also whats this on the 3 or 5 degree angleing job? Prices on having the machine shop hook up the head to run the oversized valves as well would be helpful.

ryox82

iTrader: (4)

I am def keeping this in my favs. When my second source of income comes in I will get another head and rebuild it, then drop it in the car. For now I will be doing nitrous so I dont look like an *** trying to pass ANY car on the highway. Living on your own in NY FTL!

PS You should do another video of you completing the job and dropping it in for those that have never done a ....head job, before. I know its pretty straight foward putting it back together but trust me, for people that normally don't do these things, they will feel ALOT better seeing it done first

Just my 2 cents.

MURDOCK

Triz you might like to take a look at this.
http://www.kissimmeemotorsports.com/enginespecs.htm